19840508 City Council MinutesMay 8, 1984 - Work Meeting
The regular meeting of the
Edmonds City Council was called to order at 7:30 p.m. by Mayor Larry in
the Plaza Meeting Room of the
Edmonds Library. All present joined in the the flag sal;u-te.
PRESENT
STAFF PRESENT
Larry Naughten, Mayor
Dan Prinz, Acting Police Chief
Jo -Anne Jaech
Art Housler, Finance Director
Laura Hall
Steve Simpson, Parks & Recreation Director
Steve Dwyer
Jackie Parrett, City Clerk
Jack Wilson
Jack Weinz, Fire Chief
Bill Kasper
Mary Lou Block, Planning Director
Lloyd Ostrom
Pat LeP1ay, Personnel Director
John Nordquist
Bobby Mill, Actg. Public Works Superintendent
Brian Stewart, Student Rep.
Mark Eames, City Attorney
Scott Snyder, City Attorney
Shirlie Witzel, Recorder
Mayor Naughten introduced Arnold Lunnum, President of Edmonds Lodge 130 of The Sons of Norway. Mr.
Lunnum introduced members of the Lodge: Mr. & Mrs. Garrett Missler, Ms. Dagnexr pedersen, and Ns. Judy
England. He then presented the Mayor with an honorary membership card together with a Charter P1ember
pin and invited Mayor Naughten to visit during a regular lodge meeting or social event. Mayor
Naughten thanked the Lodge and Mr. Lunnum.
May 8, 1984 - continued
CONSENT AGENDA
•
Items (B) and (E) were withdrawn from the Consent Agenda. Mayor Naughten noted; that, Item (I.),
(Authorization for. Mayor to sign ratified Public Works and..Police Ci,vi.lian.Contracts,) had been
withdrawn for further work. COUNCILMEMBER DWYER. MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNC.ILMEMBER JAECH, TO APPROVE
THE BALANCE OF THE CONSENT AGENDA: MOTION CARRIED. The approved items on the,Consent Agenda in-
cluded the following:
(A) Roll call.
(C) Passage of.Resolution 585 commending former City.Clerk Irene Varney Moran.
(D) Passage of Resolution 586 commending. former Police: Chief Marlo M., Foster.
(F) Adoption of Ordinance 2425 Permitting Fishing Pier Maintenance (Underwater).
(G) Approval of proposed fund raiser for Fire/Rescue B,oat (Exporer,Post 106,).
(H) Acceptance of Quit Claim Deed.,for. Right-of-way,(Linton).
APPROVAL OF MINUTES OF APRIL 24, 1984 [Item (B) on Consent Agenda]
Councilmember Kasper remarked that.severa l.items were missing from. the minutes, specifi.call_y, during
discussion of the copy machine,:several po,ints.were missing... He said he,had.made comments that had
been described.as-council discussion, and he asked that future minutes accurately reflect specific
comments made by council members., COUNCILMEMBER,KASPER MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER.JAECH, THAT
THE MINUTES OF APRIL 24, 1984 BE APPROVED. MOTION CARRIED.
PROPOSED'ORDINANCE 2426 EXTENDING..SIGN CODE MORATORIUM FOR HIGHWAY 99,[Item .(E) on Consent Agenda]
Councilmember Dwyer pointed out that the date must be decided before the ordinance may be adopted.
COUNCILMEMBER.JAECH MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER OSTROM, TO PLACE THIS ITEM LATER IN THE AGENDA
AS ITEM 5. - 110TION: CARRIED.
PRESENTATION OF COMMENDATIONS
Mayor Naughten presented Irene.Varney.Moran and,Marlo M. Foster with plaques commending their
service with the City.:
COUNCIL ACTION ON PLANNING BOARD RECOMMENDATION FOR SIGN CODE (CONTINUED FROM PUBLIC HEARING
OF APRIL 17, 1984).
Planning Director Mary Lou Block reviewed the action taken by the Council during the April 17, 1984
meeting. The Council had approved the Planning Board recommendation on measuring sign area (all
zones), landscaping (Highway 99), and location of freestanding signs (all zones). Those items
continued to this meeting were sign formula (Highway.99), nonconforming signs, and attached sign
height.
Sign Formula (Highway 99): COUNCILMEMBER KASPER MOVED, SECONDED FOR DISCUSSION BY COUNCILPEMBER
NORDQUIST- TO ADOPT THE PLANNING BOARD RECOMMENDATIONS ON SIGN FORMULA FOR HIGHWAY 99 AS PRESENTED
TO THE COUNCIL.:
Councilmember Ostrom remarked that he took exception to the maximum size of 160 sq. ft. for a.free-
standing sign, but supported the balance of the recommendation. He said no substantiation for
changing the sign size had been.heard by the Council, and the maximum should stay at 148 sq. ft. In
his opinion, the problem on Highway 99',J s the -variety of.poles: utility poles, light poles and pole
signs. The jumble would be encouraged by increasing sign size. The only rationale presented for
increasing the size pertained to standard lighting lengths, and they work just as well with the 148
sq. ft. size. Councilmember Dwyer noted that a major concern was the inequity of the present code
which did not allow businesses.with smaller frontages to have reasonably sized signs, e.g., Budget
Rent-A-Car; therefore, establishing a minimum allowance for freestanding signs is a good idea. He
agreed with Councilmember Ostrom concerning the maximum sign size. He suggested the best way to
address any inequities among differing municipality codes would be to meet with those municipalities
and agree to a signage code along Highway 99, if possible. Councilmember Jaech agreed with pre-
ceding comments concerning the minimum sign allowance and the maximum sign size. She also supported
Councilmember Dwyer's.suggestion.that the City meet with the�County and City abutting Edmonds to
attempt to reach an agreement that would enhance the area. Councilmember Wilson said one reason for
using 160 sq. ft. was for visibility at the speeds travelled on Highway 99. In regard to the
clutter, he did not belive there would be much difference between 160 and 148 sq. ft. and there is
not much the Council can do to effect a change in that clutter.. Councilmember Hall remarked that
she agreed with Councilmember Wilson based on the letters received from business people on Highway
99. In addition, since the height limit has been increased:on'Hi.ghway•99, a�160 sq. ft. sign is not
very large for a three, five, or ten story building. She said this is a size business,.people can live
with and it not incongruous to neighboring municipalities and she will support the recommendation.
Councilmember Jaech said a four -lane highway with a 45 mph speed limit requires a minimum of 90
square feet for signs to be easily recognized. Based on that information she said the present size
of 148 square feet is more than adequate.
Since major accesses to Edmonds are at 196th, 212th, 220th and the County line, Councilmember
Nordquist expressed concern since merchants on Highway 99 must rely on their signage to aid people
in finding,their place of business. He said the merchants should be given a chance; saying they.
need tb be more visible and he will vote for the recommendation as presented. A ROLL CALL VOTE WAS
TAKEN WIfH'COUNCILMEMBERS HALL,.WILSON, KASPER AND NORDQUIST VOTING YES; COUNCILMEMBERS JAECH, DWYER
AND OSTROM VOTING NO. MOTION CARRIED.
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• May 8, 1984 - continued
Councilmember Dwyer commented that those members voting no did so because of the question of.the 160
square foot maximum only not because of opposition to any other points in the recommendation.
Nonconforming Signs: Councilmember Dwyer said this issue seems to be of great concern to everyone
appearing before the Council. He said the idea contained in the recommendation from the Planning
Board was good in that if a sign was left alone nothing would have to change. He expressed concern
in regard to the way in which the recommendation evolved. At the Planning Board meeting, the City
Attorney presented a memorandum, dated March 8, which contained nine.possible conditions that would
call for a sign being brought into.conformance. He noted that this memorandum was not discussed at
any length by the Planning Board and, instead, the idea of a 25% rem del was discussed. He asked
for discussion of a grandfather clause which would incorporate the f rst eight conditions itemized
in that memorandum and a ninth condition being the remodeling condition tied to a 25% change in the
building. Ms. Block asked if the exceptions in the present code rel ting to a simple name change
would be -included in the recommendation. City Attorney Mark Eames noted that the Council did not
have to accept all the items on the list and could add others if th y wished.
Councilmember Wilson read an excerpt from the Palm Desert Sign Code. Mr. Eames read that portion of
the code pertaining to a definition of change. In regard.to the Palm Desert Code, a question was
asked concerning who would review the changes to a sign. Ms. 6� ck suggested that a building
inspector would be most likely...to„make the::deter.mination.°of change. Councilmember Jaech read from
another paragraph of the same Code pertaining to requiri conformance of signs upon transfer of
ownership. She also read that portion pertaining t change in tenants when the new tenant is not
aware a sign is nonconforming. In response to a question from Councilmember Jaech, Mr. Eames said
it would be difficult to attach anything to a business that would alert anyone to the sign require-
ments. Councilmember Wilson said a change in use of land or building is not covered in what has
been read from the Palm Desert Code; but he feels that concept should be included in any provision
the Council adopts.
Mr. Eames suggested that the Council might wish to list the conditions that -would require conform-
ance,.then.the.City Attorney would put it into final form for the ordinance. Councilmember Wilson
said the portion pertaining to expansion, extension, rebuilding, etc., is good and also something
must be said pertaining to 25% of the.bui,lding value on expansion, remodel, or change in the build-
ing. Mr. Eames asked if the intent was thata change in the name would also be a condition for;
compliance. Councilmember. Jaech-said a name change would be .an alteration and should require compli-
ance, since a name change usually occurs upon change of ownership. However, Councilmember Hall said
a change of name does not always mean a change of ownership. Mayor Naughten suggested that.a name
change without an ownership change could be allowed: Mr. Eames commented that.the ordinance and
event for bringing the sign into conformance must be related to the public purpose. There would
have to be a distinction related to that public purpose between a name change related to a new
business coming in and a name change where the business doesn't change. If there is no distinction
related to the public purpose of the sign ordinance.Ahe Council cannot make that distinction.
Under the language proposed, any change that is not connected with maintenance or protection of the
public safety is a change requiring conformance.. Councilmember Jaech interjected that a change of
ownership is the time to bring the sign into conformance. Councilmember Wilson commented that idea
places:a burden upon the small business which might cause loss of a sale if a new sign were required.
He asked Ms. Block what business people are looking for that would be compatible and encourage
annexation. Ms. Block commented that she had heard from businesses who have already annexed that
their concern was having to change their sign immediately upon annexation.. She said they feel the
.25% change to a building would be fair since the cost of a sign change could be included within any
financing needed for.the building change. Councilmember.Wilson commented that there are businesses
that might annex if the City makes it palatable for them to do so. In addition, he said, the signs
will stay there whether they annex or not. Councilmember Dwyer asked if a change of ownership
without requiring a change of tenants might be a condition for compliance. Councilmember Dwyer
asked if an ordinance like that would palatable to those businesses that the City would like to see
annex. Councilmember Hall suggested the Council use the Attorney's recommendations on grandfather
clauses -with the eight or nine conditions listed and then use the ADB for review of the noncon-
forming signs when there is a change. That the the
provides criteria, grandfather rights, and a
process which deals. with existing signs and annexations. Councilmember Dwyer expressed a reserva-
tion with that idea since people want to know when they annex what will happen. Councilmember
Wilson.said, if the City adopts a sign code that does not encourage businesses to annex, the signs
willstillbe there. He said making change of ownership a condition may be too rigid, since
businesses change hands because they are marginal. Councilmember Kasper said an owner would have to
put up a new sign to get a new tenant, if the. old business.failed. Councilmember. Wilson said the
City should be creating an environment which will make -people want.to come into the City. Council -
member Jaech said Newport Beach and the Irvine area had gone through .a complete sign change by
working toward bringing signs into conformance over a period of years. As a result, the area is
aesthetically pleasing and people are attracted -to shop there. She said the Council had brought up
the grandfather clause, so signs can be brought into compliance with the code. Councilmember Dwyer
said there are reasons for wanting to annex these businesses other than for revenue; annexation
allows the City to regulate land use and prevents the problem of City areas abutting County areas.
The.City should be -concerned about eventually bringing signs into -conformance. Another point to
consider is the progress that has been made in arriving at a compromise from very divergent points
of view. Councilmember Ostrom suggested that the amortization period be extended to whatever time
is necessary. He said a sign.code is necessary, but.it may be years before someone will be in a.
position to put up a new sign that will conform. The amortization would also apply to newly annexed
areas. COUNCILMEMBER OSTROM MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER JAECH, THAT THE COUNCIL ADOPT A LONGER
AMORTIZATION PERIOD AS DEFINED IN PARAGRAPH C OF MEMORANDUM FROM CITY ATTORNEY DATED MARCH 8, 1984.
Mr. Eames explained that would allow sign owners to appear before the Hearing Examiner and ask for
longer amortization periods; and signs which are annexed would have 5 years plus the opportunity to
ask,for a longer period. Councilmember Ostrom commented that if five years is not enough, they have
opportunity to request a longer extension. Councilmember Dwyer expressed concern that the Council
will find itself in a similar situation if people fail to meet the criteria listed in the memorandum.
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May 8, 1984 - continued •
He added that he would prefer adoption of a solution that would keep the Council from having to deal
with noncofforming signs again. He expressed concern that a business might have a sign for a long
time, the amortization period could expire, and they would not be able to meet the criteria which
would be applied, and would have to take the sign down. He said the Council should allow a sign
that is not changed to stay as long as the owner wishes. Councilmember Kasper said he would vote
against"ihe motion since he believes changes should be tied to a 25% change in the building and a
change of use in the business, since a change of use is not a matter of selling a marginal business
and would not place a burden on the seller. A ROLL CALL VOTE WAS,TAKEN WITH COUNCILMEMBERS JAECH
AND OSTROM:WTING YES; COUNCILMEMBERS HALL, DWYER, WILSON, KASPER AND NORQUIST VOTING NO. MOTION
FAILED.
COUNCILMEMBER WILSON MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER HALL, THAT NONCONFORMING SIGNS MAY NOT BE
EXPANDED, EXTENDED, REBUILT, ALTERED OR RECONSTRUCTED IN ANY WAY, EXCEPT FOR NORMAL MAINTENANCE OR
TO PROTECT THE PUBLIC SAFETY, AND THAT NONCONFORMING SIGNS.SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO REMAIN UNTIL THE
REMODEL OR ADDITION TO THE BUILDING EQUAL TO 25% OF THE BUILDING VALUE OCCURS OR IF THE USAGE OF THE
BUILDING CHANGES. THIS WOULD INCLUDE NONCONFORMING SIGNS ANNEXED TO THE CITY. Councilmember Dwyer
asked if a change in the use of the land or building should be included and Councilmembers Wilson
and Hall agreed to the change in the wording of the motion, "...OR IF THE USE OF THE LAND OR BUILD-
ING CHANGES." Mr. Eames asked if a name change would require conformance. Councilmember Wilson
indicated that was not his intent. Mr. Eames read that portion of the present sign code which
states that a change in name does not require conformance. Councilmembers Wilson and Hall agreed
that the motion should include the wording "...EXCEPT FOR NORMAL MAINTENANCE, A CHANGE OF NAME WHICH
DOES NOT CHANGE THE COLOR SCHEME, OR TO PROTECT THE PUBLIC SAFETY..." MOTION CARRIED.
Ms. Block asked if the new ordinance would insure that all.nonconforming signs on a property would
be brought into compliance if any change were made to the sign package., Mr. Eames said a motion
would be necessary to add that provision to the motion just passed. He noted that one item listed
in the memorandum prepared by his office was that construction of new signs on the same property
would require compliance of all signs. COUNCILMEMBER DWYER MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER HALL,
TO ADD THE PROVISION THAT ALL NONCONFORMING SIGNS ON A PROPERTY WOULD BE BROUGHT INTO COMPLIANCE IF
ANY'CHANGE IS MADE TO THE SIGN PACKAGE EXCEPT AS NOTED IN THE PREVIOUS MOTION. MOTION CARRIED.
Attached`Sign Height: Councilmember Jaech asked Ms. Block if the present sign code indicates the
location of the sign on the building. Hs. Block replied that the code states that no attached sign
shall exceed 14'; and the ADB has the flexibility at this time.to exceed that height and/or to
decide sign location under the general provisions of the sign ordinance and the ADB criteria.
Councilmember Hall remarked that the Planning Board recomendation would be sufficient.using just the
first sentence. Councilmember Kasper pointed out that the Planning•Board, according to their
minutes, was trying to prevent seeing a sign over the top of a building from the back side, to limit
it below the height of the building.
COUNCILMEMBER HALL MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER KASPER, THAT THE 14-FOOT. LIMITATION SHOULD
BE REMOVED AND THE ARCHITECTURAL DESIGN BOARD BE ALLOWED THE FLEXIBILITY TO DECIDE SIGN LOCATION.
ALSO, THE HEIGHT OF THE SIGN SHOULD BE LIMITED TO THE TOP OF THE PARAPET ON A FLAT -ROOFED BUILDING
AND THE DRIP LINE ON A PITCHED ROOF. Mr. Eames asked if the ADB decision on sign location would be
subject to Chapter 20.10. COUNCILMEMBER HALL INDICATED THAT THE ADB DECISION ON SIGN LOCATION
SHOULD BE SUBJECT TO CHAPTER 20.10. Seconder agreed. Councilmember Dwyer indicated he was opposed
to the motion in its entirety. He said the Council reaches a point where delegation becomes abdi-
cation. Any further delegation to the ADB would be abdication of authority by the Council. In
addition, he sees no need for removal of the 14-foot limitation. He said flexibility can be viewed
as arbitrariness and both are just words for a lack of standards. Councilmember Hall indicated that
flexibility is contained in the present code. She noted that the ADB is told to do a little bit but
that they can't handle it all. Councilmember Jaech said the ADB should follow the guidelines and
procedures set for them. She feels the Council should not delegate their responsibility and the
current -'code should remain the same. A ROLL CALL VOTE WAS TAKEN WITH COUNCILMEMBERS HALL, WILSON
AND KASPER:VOTING YES; COUNCILMEMBERS JAECH, DWYER, OSTROM, AND NORDQUIST VOTING NO. MOTION FAILED.
Councilmember Wilson noted that the 14-foot height is not necessarily the problem since the ADB has
the latitude to ignore that or anything else. Councilmember Jaech asked the City Attorney to pro-
duce an ordinance which had been prepared in response to a motion passed in November 1983 to have
any deviations from the existing code go to the Hearing Examiner. She said the ordinance had been
delayed until the Council had opportunity to .go over the sign code and establish criteria. Council -
member Kasper noted that it is important to read the minutes of the last joint meeting. He said the
issue of height occurs when the building code is exceeded, because the sign can be seen over the
building, which no one wants. He asked the Council not to take action to move this to the Hearing
Examiner, who will give a legal determination, since design is not a legal entity. Design must be
based on rationale, not criteria. Moving this to the Hearing Examiner will destroy the design
atmosphere of sign design and end up with something worse. He commented that some of the areas
referred to in California are so standardized, they look as though they came out of a book. He said
variety is the originality of the town and that progressive gray interpretation is needed, not black
and white. The Council should be asking the ADB to work in the gray areas. The Boards should be
allowed to function, if they get out of hand then something can be done. Councilmember Hall agreed.
She said the make-up of the ADB consists of an architect, a planner, and an engineer. If the
Council is going to have the Hearing Examiner, why have the ADB and the criteria. The ADB deals
with the creative area and the Council has no business being in the design area. She said the
Council created the Board and should respect them.
Councilmember Jaech noted that parameters had been given to the ADB within which to work and design
could be handled within that scope. When someone wishes to go outside those parameters the Hearing
Examiner is the one to review.why they want to go outside the scope and how it coincides with the
Code and the wishes of the citizenry. Councilmember Wilson commented that people want to go outside
the scope because of the aesthetics of the building, setbacks, heights, and design and asked what
the Hearing Examiner would know about those aspects. Councilmember Jaech said the Hearing Examiner
would know just as much as the ADB.. Councilmember Hall said that the Hearing Examiner had indicated
he does not know about those areas. Councilmember Jaech.read the Ordinance of the City of Edmonds
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• May 8, 1984 - continued
amending Section 20.60.020B of the Edmonds Commu►ii•ty Development Code to remove the authority of the
ADB to modify provisions of the sign code and adding a new section 20.60.100E to provide for vari
ances to be heard by the Hearing Examiner under specified criteria. She said the Ordinance was
written following a meeting in November where the majority of the Council decided to have any
variances come before the Hearing Examiner but i.t had been delayed until the Council had had.an
opportunity to review the sign code. In relation -to attached sign height the Council has just
voted to not give the ADB flexibility in that area. COUNCILMEMBER,JAECH MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCIL -
MEMBER OSTROM, TO ADOPT ORDINANCE 2421 PROVIDING FOR VARIANCES TO BE HEARD BY THE HEARING EXAMINER.
Councilmember Hall expressed disagreement with the motion. She said the intent and psychology of
the ADB abrogates the need for a variance. That is their purvue and they should deal with creativity.
Councilmember Ostrom expressed support of the motion. He said design restrictions are not the sub-
ject, an infinite amount of creativity exists w.ithin.the maximums that have been established by .the
Council. If the Council turns the writing of the Code over to the ADB, he said, they are abdicating
their authority as mentioned by Councilmember Dwyer. He reiterated that the Council establishes the
maximums and the ADB interprets within those maximums. Many times the ADB make requirements beyond
Code requirements in attempting to achieve a more aestetically pleasing design. For the ADB to judge
the aesthetics and also go beyond the Code would be a deriliction of duty in his opinion. Council -
member Kasper. --pointed out.the Minutes of April 11 and 25, saying they were very helpful in discern-
ing what-is,:needed. He said there should be a complete hearing before the Council decides on this
subject:.; The -ordinance was.done prior to all the appeals and a complete re -hearing of the subject
should be held. A ROLL CALL VOTE WAS TAKEN WITH COUNCILMEMBERS JAECH, DWYER, OSTROM, AND NORDQUIST
VOTING YES; COUNCILMEMBERS HALL, WILSON, AND KASPER VOTING NO. MOTION CARRIED. Councilmember
Kasper commented that this vote had destroyed everything the Council had accomplished this evening.
He said he would not annex•to the City with this motion in effect.
Councilmembers Hall and Kasper left the room at this point.
Councilmember Jaech asked for a time frame upon which to establish a date for extension of the
moratorium. Mr. Eames explained that the earliest date for these ordinances.to.take effect would be
May 21, but suggested the Council might prefer to give themselves some leeway in.the event of any
Changes that may need to be made. COUNCILMEMBER JAECH MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER OSTROM, TO
ADOPT ORDINANCE 2426 EXTENDING THE SIGN CODEA4O RATORIUM ON HIGHWAY 99 TO JUNE.15, 1984. MOTION
CARRIED. Councilmembers Hall and Kasper were not present to vote.
CONTINUED DISCUSSION RE CIVIC CENTER FIELD
Parks and Recreation Director Steve Simpson showed a transparency relating to theSixYear Capital
Improvement Plan implemented in.1979. He briefly discussed the restrictions placed on the Civic
Center Playfield during the past two years. He said the proposed project would change the use of the
Civic Center field from an adult.field to a youth oriented field, which should cause less conflict
according to the neighbors of that area. Part of the grandstand structure would be preserved and
integrated into the new building. Also, the jogging paths would be improved and expanded as part of
the downtown revitalization. Mr. Simpson described the phases he had recommended to the Council for
consideration.
Councilmembers Hall and Kasper returned to the Council table.
Mr. Simpson noted that adoption of the Master plan by the School District will open the way for the
City -to begin negotiating values of improvements to the Woodway Field, which could be applied to
acquiring the Civic Center Field. To determine the value of the Civic Center Field and the improve-
ments to the Woodway field, an appraisal will be required. The estimated cost for an appraisal is
$5000 for the City and $5000 for the School District. A single appraiser is proposed since it is a
friendly exchange of property. In addition, the City.would have to adopt the Master plan, authorize
the Mayor to contract with an appraiser for the necessary appraisal, and indicate what portion of
the proposed project the staff should work on and,.what methods of financing should be pursued:
• Mayor Naughten listed the projects and indicated their user 1. Woodway athletic facility would be
used by adults and young adults for evening games. 2. Civic Center youth services building would
be used by the boys' club and youth club and would support the youth programs of the community: 3.
Civic Center covered pool would benefit the entire community. 4. Civic Center park would be for
youth play and community activities such as the jogging track and the performance area. The cost to
each homeowner would be $48.28 based on $100,000home value. This figure assumes no other money is
available, and there are other sources.' Mayor Naughten compared this figure with $23.52 spend on
the Port District, which does not benefit very many people; and $16.43 which is spent on the Hospi-
tal District and benefits everyone: The Mayor reiterated that everyone is benefited by some thing
in the proposed package. The .community is also benefited and the proposal is supported by the
Chamber of Commerce. Another benefit is increased property values. The location of the project
within the 'bowl' area will also benefit the retail merchants and will attract young families to
Edmonds:
Councilmember Nordquist asked if there were any mechanisms to provide citizen feedback on the
proposal. Mayor Naughten said there were none. He commented that there is citizen support but they
are waiting for the Council's decision on which portions of the project will be pursued before
speaking out. Councilmember Dwyer asked if there is a method to present the project to voters in
different phases to -avoid defeat of the -entire package because one portion may not be popular. He
said his concern was that the project could be defeated if the pool were included, since the issue
of the pool had emerged later in the study. If it were separated from the project and presented as
a separate item there might be better chance for passage. Councilmember Jaech suggested the Council
look at adopting the master plan, then discuss financing. Councilmember Ostrom noted that a project
of this scope.should be placed before the people. Councilmember Kasper commented that the subject
had started as a pool, then the Civic Center was added and now the two are being combined, with
Woodway added. It was his opinion that:the entire package could not be voted upon. He will not
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May 8, 1984 - continued- •
support reduction of the athletic fields at the Civic Center to a park, even with
the fields at
Woodway. He said the City is park poor, noting -that most..of the -Block -Grant money
had gone
into the
beaches, the fishing pier and maintenance of those areas. He said the.parks.are
basically
neglected
throughout the City. A swimming pool may be needed nearer or in the 'bowl', but
the usage
of that
facility is yet to be determined. This is a long range program and the key would
be to cover
the
pool immediately. If the pool is supported over the next five or six years, then
consider
a major
pool in another location. He noted that taking adult use away from Civic Center
fields when that
use is increasing does not make sense.
Councilmember Ostrom commented that the genesis of the project was an attempt to
solve the
problem
of the playfield. the plan presented by the citizen's committee is excellent. The
Council
must
take some action to solve the problem.
Councilmember Hall asked if the problem.of the lights would be solved if the lights were removed
from the Civic Center field and placed at Woodway. Councilmember Ostrom said removal. of the lights
would help, but there are problems with noise and the other items that people had discussed last
summer.
Councilmember Nordquist asked if the possibility of County support in the Woodway Project had been
explored, since that field will be used by County residents as well as the City. Councilmember
Jaech expressed concern regarding usage, since the City had not been able to provide adequate time
for everyone to -use the present field. If the County were involved, there would.also be County
teams to consider. Councilmember Nord.quist replied that current use of the field is by teams from
Seattle and Bellevue as well as Edmonds. If Edmonds teams were the only users, the field would not
be used half the time. Councilmember Nordquist noted the South Snohomish Planning Council had
explored concepts of sharing facilities. COUNCILMEMBER JAECH MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER
NORDQUIST, TO APPROVE THE CONCEPT THAT HAS BEEN PRESENTED IN THE CITIZENS' MASTER PLAN. She ex-
plained that she was not addressing the financing, just the overall general concept of the plan.
Councilmember Hall noted that she sees five parts not an overall concept. She noted that the City
has a $1.00 a year lease for use of the playfield and.it does not.make good business sense to not
take advantage of it. She might feel more comfortable if there were some public hearings indicating
support of the project. Otherwise she could not support it. Councilmember Kasper said he could not
support removing recreation from the playfield. He added that he was not willing to take the money
out of the City to Meadowdale. Many people using Edmonds facilities do not live in Edmonds, and he
suggested there could be an interlocal agreement for use of Meadowdale fields.. The .City does not
have the ability to use Block Grants for recreation and there is no revenue for that use. He is
very concerned with the fact that the recreational aspect of the new district has not been expanded.
He said he had asked for a ruling from Olympia on whether recreational use can be added to the
performing arts district or create a new district to build these fields and carry the process out
with the School District or whether the City cannot. Councilmember Jaech withdrew her motion.
Mayor Naughten suggested the Council go through the proposal item by item to determine a consensus.
COUNCILMEMBER HALL MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER OSTROM, THAT CITY STAFF WORK ON DEVELOPMENT
OF THE WOODWAY ATHLETIC FACILITY, WHICH WOULD INCLUDE LIGHTED BASEBALL, SOFTBALL, AND SOCCER FIELDS
AND A CONCESSION STAND. Student Representative Stewart commented that inclusion of other portions
of the proposed project would be an advantage since more people would be benefited.. Councilmember
Ostrom said he agreed with the motion but believes the Council should have an overall concept that
links.all of the various items together. The City needs more big picture plans. If the Council
could adopt the concept discussed earlier,.they could start implementing those portions that were
affordable. Councilmember Hall explained that acceptance of the package is a problem for her
because it is tied to loss of the inexpensive $1.00/year cost for use of the Civic Center play -
field. Councilmember Jaech stated that the cost to the City will not be known until the entire
concept is accepted. Councilmember Hall said she did not object to the concept as.far as everyone
having a place for athletic activities, but she does not feel it is a good business deal. Council -
member Ostrom said there is a problem anytime life is made unlivable in any part of a City, some-
thing.. must be done to correct the situation. If the playfield must stay the way it is, then he
would advise closing -it down rather than spend another year aggravating the neighborhood. Council -
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'member Hall said the acitivity at the playfield should be mitigated as much as possible; however,
building -a complex as proposed would continue the same problem with noise and traffic. Perhaps the
* only solution would be to close the playfield.
Councilmember Kasper said another example of neighborhood impact is the Library. A parking problem
has emerged throughout the neighborhood and the complexion of the neighborhood has changed complete-
ly. The same thing is true of the arterial on 9th Ave. which split a residential neighborhood in
half. The play areas in question at Civic Center Playfield should not be reduced in time or area.
The new homes that have gone in were aware of the activity and knew of the liqhting that was pro-
posed. Councilmember Jaech said the property owners around the playfield are only required to bear
the burden of what was in existence at the time they moved in, which did not include the new lights.
She said the City has caused a greater impact and needs to assess what has been done in the area and
attempt to solve the problem. In assessing the uses of the playfield, she said, it was found other
needs were not being addressed. That was when the committee was developed with a representative
from each of the users to develop.an idea for a solutionto existing problems and address the needs
of the community. Councilmember. Ostrom commented that the neighborhood supported the proposed
concept and.had been given a part in designing the solution to the problem. Councilmember Hall said
the City must be cautious in levying the amount of the proposal on everyone to solve a neighborhood
problem.
Mayor Naughten asked the Council to look at the needs of the community for the next 20 years and
determine the best location for lighted fields, jogging tracks, inside the City or outside the City,
etc. Once that is determined, financing can be tackled and -then the City can find out if the public
really wants the proposed project. Councilmember Jaech said some action should be taken this evening.
MOTION CARRIED.
*See May 15, 1984 Minutes
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w May 8, 1984 - continued
COUNCILMEMBER KASPER MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER HALL, THAT THE STAFF DEVELOP A PLAN FOR AN
INTERIM POOL COVER FOR YOST POOL. Councilmember Kasper supported his motion by saying there is no
proof at this time that a pool would be fully utili-zed. This is a method to see what the people
will support, the cost is nominal and allows other capital to be used, in developing Woodway. It
would also use up the remaining life of the present pool. A ROLL CALL VOTE WAS TAKEN WITH COUNCIL -
MEMBERS HALL, WILSON, KASPER, AND NORDQUIST VOTING YES; COUNCILMEMBERS JAECH, DWYER AND OSTROM
VOTING NO. MOTION CARRIED.
Councilmember Kasper commented that the City should be very particular in selecting an appraiser and
suggested that the City and the School District should retain separate appraisers.
COUNCILMEMBER JAECH MOVED, SECONDED FOR DISCUSSION BY COUNCILMEMBER NORDQUIS.T, THAT THE CITY ACCEPT
THE CONCEPT THAT A CIVIC CENTER YOUTH SERVICES BUILDING SHOULD BE CONSTRUCTED TO HOUSE BOYS' &
GIRLS' CLUBS, YOUTH CLUB, AND INCLUDE A GYMNASIUM. Councilmember Jaech said the building would be
constructed on the Civic Center site and would incorporate part of the grandstand. A ROLL CALL VOTE
WAS.TAKEN WITH COUNCILMEMBERS JAECH, DWYER, OSTROM., AND NORDQUIST VOTING YES; COUNCILMEMBERS KASPER,
WILSON AND HALL VOTING NO. Councilmember Hall stated she voted no for the reasons stated previously.
MOTION CARRIED.
COUNCILMEMBER JAECH MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER OSTROM, THAT THE COUNCIL ACCEPT THE CONCEPT OF
CONSTRUCTING A CIVIC CENTER COVERED POOL. Councilmember Dwyer said covering Yost Pool to see if
people would support a pool would indicate waiting to see if that is supported before considering
another pool. Councilmember Jaech.said it would be shortsighted to spend $140,000 to see if people
want to utilize a swimming pool. She said it was more rational and less expensive to put the idea
on the ballot. A ROLL CALL VOTE WAS TAKEN WITH COUNCILMEMBERS JAECH, DWYER, AND OSTROM VOTING YES;
COUNCILMEMBERS HALL, WILSON, KASPER AND NORDQUIST VOTING NO. MOTION FAILED.
COUNCILMEMBER JAECH MOVED, SECONDED,BY COUNCILMEMBER OSTROM, TO ACCEPT THE CONCEPT OF CONSTRUCTING A
• CIVIC CENTER PARK TO INCLUDE CIVIC CENTER PLAZA, OUTDOOR PERFORMANCE AREA, JOGGING TRACKS, YOUTH
BASEBALL AND SOCCER AREAS, PARKING LOTS AND PASSIVE USE AREAS. MOTION CARRIED WITH COUNCILMEMBERS
KASPER AND WILSON VOTING NO.
Councilmember Kasper asked that the final choice of appraiser be approved by the Council. Mayor
Naughten said the staff would provide information on the.cost of an appraiser and the architectural
design on Woodway. Councilmember Jaech asked that a time frame be established to make sure all
necessary actions are taken in order to get these items on the September ballot.
REVIEW COUNCIL WORK MEETING PROPOSAL
Mayor Naughten said the information before the Council was the result of input from Council Members
.and other Cities. COUNCILMEMBER NORDQUIST MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER WILSON, THAT THE COUNCIL
ADOPT THE REVISED WORK MEETING FORMAT AND COUNCIL MEETING HOURS AS PRESENTED. Mr. Eames said an
ordinance would be drafted to change the appropriate section of the Code and would be on the consent
agenda for May 15. MOTION CARRIED.
MAYOR
Mayor Naughten proclaimed May 7-12 as Edmonds High School Week.
The Mayor proclaimed the week of May 15 as National Police Week and the day of Play 15 as Police
Memorial Day.
Mayor Naughten said he and Councilmember Hall had met on May 7 with the Police Department and 20
residents of Sunset Ave. to discuss the coming summer season. The Mayor complimented Student Rep-
resentative Stewart for attending the meeting.
The Mayor said a task force had been named for the Downtown Plain Street Development Program con-
• sisting of Marlo Foster, John McGibbon, Lloyd Ostrom, Jacque Mayo, Bill Auerswald of the Port
District, Dick Beselin of Harbor Square, and the core committee being Dave Earling, Mary Lou Block
and Jim Morrow..- Their f.sr-st meeting is May., 21. =
Mayor Naughten asked if any Council Members would be attending the AWC convention in Yakima.
Councilmembers Nordquist and Hall responded. COUNCILMEMBER NORDQUIST MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCIL -
MEMBER OSTROM, THAT THE JUNE 12 COUNCIL MEETING BE MOVED TO MONDAY JUNE 11. MOTION CARRIED.
The Mayor said the information from the attorney on the Civil Service issue will be available next
week.
Mayor Naughten said a group of politicians, two Mayors and one Presidential Advisor, and a member of
the State Department had visited Edmonds last week.
The Mayor introduced Melissa Steineger, of the Enterprise, who is filling in for Ron Post this
evening.
.COUNCIL
Councilmember Hall called attention to the program she had given each Council member for Edmonds
Senior High. She reported on the school's preparation for next week. She complimented Police Chief
Dan Prinz in getting the meeting arranged with the residents on Sunset Ave. She reported that it
was a good meeting.
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May 8, 1984 - continued
Councilmember Dwyer reported that SNOCOM spent 24.78% of its budget during the first quarter.
Councilmember.Kasper asked that the Edmonds Public Disclosure Ordinance be placed on the agenda. He
said there are inconsistencies with the State and the document should be corrected. He said there
is a Community Services Committee meeting next week and asked for Council support of the City
Engineer's request for retention maintenance ponds.
Councilmember Kasper asked for a total financial report.for the Council of how much was spent on
Dayton St'.during construction, and the funding sources.
Council President Jaech reported that she had requested copies of personnel vacancy announcements so
the Council would know what,is going on in the City. She reminded everyone of the workshop sched-
uled on May 19 at 8:00 a.m. in Community Services Staff Lounge,. indicating the Council would review
items discussed at the retreat.
Council President Jaech said several neighbors around 555 Walnut St. had asked her to correct a
situation involving children playing in the building excavation area. Mayor Naughten said he had
discussed the situation with Ms. Block and the developer.will be asked to secure the area.
Council President Jaech said there is a problem at the"intersection of 9th and Casper with dirt and
gravel on the roadway. She asked that someone supervise and keep the road clean.
Councilmember.Hall commented on the thank -you note from Mr. Simpson.
Since there was no further business to come before the Council, the meeting adjourned at 10:35
p.m.
LARRY S. NAUGHTEN, P1ayor .
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