2024-04-16 Council Minutes
Edmonds City Council Approved Minutes
April 16, 2024
Page 1
EDMONDS CITY COUNCIL MEETING
APPROVED MINUTES
April 16, 2024
ELECTED OFFICIALS PRESENT
Mike Rosen, Mayor
Vivian Olson, Council President
Chris Eck, Councilmember
Will Chen, Councilmember
Neil Tibbott, Councilmember
Michelle Dotsch, Councilmember
Susan Paine, Councilmember
Jenna Nand, Councilmember
STAFF PRESENT
Oscar Antillon, Public Works Director
Susan McLaughlin, Planning & Dev. Dir.
Rob English, City Engineer
Mike De Lilla, Senior Utilities Engineer
Mike Clugston, Senior Planner
Jeff Taraday, City Attorney
Scott Passey, City Clerk
Jerrie Bevington, Camera Operator
1. CALL TO ORDER/FLAG SALUTE
The Edmonds City Council meeting was called to order at 7 pm by Mayor Rosen in the Council Chambers,
250 5th Avenue North, Edmonds, and virtually. The meeting was opened with the flag salute.
2. LAND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT
Councilmember Nand read the City Council Land Acknowledge Statement: “We acknowledge the original
inhabitants of this place, the Sdohobsh (Snohomish) people and their successors the Tulalip Tribes, who
since time immemorial have hunted, fished, gathered, and taken care of these lands. We respect their
sovereignty, their right to self-determination, and we honor their sacred spiritual connection with the land
and water.”
3. ROLL CALL
City Clerk Scott Passey called the roll. All elected officials were present.
4. PRESENTATION
1. EARTH DAY 2024 PROCLAMATION
Mayor Rosen read a proclamation proclaiming April 22, 2024 as Earth Day in Edmonds and encouraging
residents, businesses and institutions to use Earth Day to celebrate the earth and commit to building a
sustainable and green economy.
Mayor Rosen presented the proclamation to Brittany Ahman, Sound Salmon Solutions. Ms. Ahman said it
was an honor to receive the proclamation. She thanked the City for funding the Edmonds Stewards program
and Sound Salmon Solutions who manages the program. The Edmonds Stewards are a passionate group of
volunteers dedicated to the restoration of City of Edmonds parks through habitat restoration including
invasive vegetation removal and planting native trees and shrubs. Their work ensures Edmonds parks are
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April 16, 2024
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suitable not only for the community but also for native wildlife such as birds, amphibians, mammals and
pollinators. To date, the Edmonds Stewards have successfully cleared over 10 acres of invasive vegetation
within City parks and planted over 3,000 native trees and shrubs all through volunteer efforts. Anyone
interested in contributing to these efforts is invited to join them this Saturday in celebration of Earth Day at
events from 10-noon including beach clean-ups at Marina Beach and Brackett’s Landing North and forest
restoration projects at Pine Ridge Park and Yost Park. Full details and registration information is available
at SoundSalmonSolutions.org/events.
Ms. Ahman continued, Edmonds Stewards are true believers that every day should be in celebration of the
earth; not only will they be out this Saturday in celebration of Earth Day, they also invite community
volunteers to join them every Saturday at Yost Park, the second Saturday of the month at Pine Ridge Park
and the third Saturday of the month at Hutt Park. In addition there is a free training program on June 2
where community members can learn more about the Edmonds Stewards program, what is required to be
an Edmonds Steward, and what goes into habitat restoration projects.
5. APPROVAL OF AGENDA
COUNCILMEMBER PAINE MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCIL PRESIDENT OLSON, TO
APPROVE THE AGENDA IN CONTENT AND ORDER. MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
6. AUDIENCE COMMENTS
Bob Danson, General Manager, Olympic View Water and Sewer District, thanked the City for working
with the district to protect the community’s drinking water resources by adopting the City CARA code. He
also thanked City staff for collaborating with OVWSD staff, commenting it had been a great experience,
the code has come a long way and the code is pretty good although there are still some tweaks needed. He
referred to the concern he voiced in the past about infiltration of stormwater in general terms and offered
more specifics. Stormwater contains pollutants; for instance, a sample study completed at the Madrona
School in Edmonds shows there is PFAS in the stormwater being sent down into UIC wells that ultimately
go to the water aquifer layer. The EPA just lowered the maximum contaminant levels of some PFAS
elements due to the recognized health risks and it will continue to get worse as the PFAS epidemic
continues. The levels at the Madrona School stormwater right now are above those new EPA limits. In a
Lake Washington study by Ecology on total PFAS readings done in 2022, the median concentration for
atmospheric deposits (rainwater) is 2.0 and 30 in stormwater. PFAS bioaccumulates, does not break down,
is considered a forever chemical, and a soil layer is not a good filter as it goes through soil layers. Allowing
these substances to infiltrate into the ground risks polluting the drinking water aquifer. At a minimum,
OVWSD asks for one final modification, to go back to the proposed code to include the original
recommendation of no UICs in the most vulnerable exposed QVA areas.
Ardeth Weed, Edmonds, said she has passionately believed in the value of a diverse community her entire
life. Her experiences as a California teacher, a small school administrator and the parent of two mixed-race
children added to her passion. When city leaders heard about the name-calling of a Black woman on Sunset
Avenue years ago and formed a diversity commission, she began attending meetings as a community
member. When Donnie Griffin’s term was up and she had been attending meetings for about three years,
he convinced her to apply for the vacancy on the commission. She joked she represents old white women
in the community. The work the diversity commission does such as providing grants to community groups
for projects supporting diversity, and the annual film discussion series is important. None of it would have
been accomplished without the support of the talented city staff, Patrick Doherty and Cindi Cruz who were
replaced by the equally talented Todd Tatum and Megal Luttrell. She finished her 3-year term last
December and did not reapply because as a senior with an aging brain, she believed others could better
serve the community. She was right; she attended the February meeting as a community member and was
absolutely thrilled to listen to the conversations and interactions of continuing and new members as they
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April 16, 2024
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worked through the agenda. Although believing in the case is important, these members have actual
experience in their jobs and lives of making their beliefs a reality. The depth of discussion, sharing of ideas
and raising of relevant questions was impressive. The discussion included working with neighboring cities,
with Snohomish County and with other organizations in the community to continue the work of the diversity
commission to improve life in Edmonds for all citizens. She walked home with a smile on her face but also
tears in her eyes; she is proud and happy to live in Edmonds, Washington.
Theresa Hollis, Edmonds, referred to the CARA code and recommended approving the 2023 version of
the CARA ordinance. OVWSD provides her water and she supports their advice, not the Edmonds planning
board advice this year. The planning board was given incomplete information during their deliberations.
They were told PFAS aquifer contamination was rare in Washington state, two known instances, but they
were not focusing on the additional facts that 30 water systems in Washington exceed the state limit and
200 exceed the more strict federal limit. The science on PFAS is lagging behind the regulations from state
and local government. Edmonds does not gain anything significant by adopting the 2024 version of the
code language in the packet. She encouraged the council to adopt the more strict regulation against drilled
wells and infiltration systems. The lack of a stormwater pipe network in parts of south Edmonds is not
justification to have more lax regulations. From her perspective, this is not a judgment decision because
neither the council nor she has the technical knowledge to evaluate whether OVWSD’s advice or the
planning board’s advice is best. She believed it was a strategic decision for council; make the regulation
more strict today to buy time for the experts at the state Department of Ecology to define their regulations
or make it more lenient and hope nothing bad happens during their watch. If the council is lenient now with
regard to stormwater management issue, heaven help us when the council is evaluating citywide mitigations
from Herrara’s EIS; what strategy to protect the environment will the council use then? She found it ironic
she had to make this argument to the council during the same meeting as the Earth Day proclamation.
Diane Buckshnis, Edmonds, said she has made her point many times on media, at the planning board and
at council. The council needs to rethink some of their opinions about the CARA code. She concurred with
Theresa Hollis’ comments. The environment will always be here and the council needs to realize that just
one unintended consequence could ruin the aquifer. She learned a lot while on council for 13 years and on
the Salmon Recovery Council and believed it would be in the City best interest to approve the 2023 code
that restricts digging. Edmonds is very unique and she was sure there would be ramifications from new bills
once they were set in stone. She recalled very tough laws were passed related to crumb rubber; this is almost
worse than crumb rubber.
Clint Wright, Edmonds, a resident at 8th & Bell, suggested councilmembers drive up the hill and look at
what’s going on up there to get a good look at future Edmonds. Next, he urged the council to vote against
language in the packet and instead support the more strict 2023 planning board recommendation. It is
important to think about the environment more than how many dozens or hundreds of people will be moving
to Edmonds.
Joe Scordino, Edmonds, a 44 year resident of Edmonds and retired biologist, recommended disallowing
any and all UIC wells throughout the CARA, both Deer Creek and the one that extends outside the
Esperance area due to great uncertainty. It may not be on the council’s watch that those aquifers are polluted,
but it may be on someone else's watch. He questioned whether the council wanted to be responsible for
what happens in the future. He recalled when dealing with natural resources, if there was any uncertainty,
they took the risk adverse approach where risk is considered in decisions to ensure protection, in this case
protecting future generations. These pollutants affect infants and fetuses, and the last thing anyone wants
to learn 20 years from now is kids are deformed due to what is allowed today. He urged the council to
disallow any and all UIC wells over a CARA, commenting allowing them doesn’t make sense. If in the
future there is some proof there is no effect, the regulations can be changed. He preferred the council be
cautious and not move hastily regarding something there is little known about.
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April 16, 2024
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7. RECEIVED FOR FILING
1. CLAIM FOR DAMAGES FOR FILING
2. WRITTEN PUBLIC COMMENTS
8. APPROVAL OF CONSENT AGENDA ITEMS
COUNCILMEMBER PAINE MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCIL PRESIDENT OLSON, TO
APPROVE THE CONSENT AGENDA. MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. The agenda items
approved are as follows:
1. APPROVAL OF COUNCIL MINUTES MARCH 26, 2024
2. APPROVAL OF SPECIAL MEETING MINUTES APRIL 2, 2024
3. APPROVAL OF COUNCIL MINUTES APRIL 2, 2024
4. APPROVAL OF CLAIM CHECKS AND WIRE PAYMENTS
5. APPROVAL OF PAYROLL AND BENEFIT CHECKS, DIRECT DEPOSIT AND WIRE
PAYMENTS
6. SNOHOMISH COUNTY - CITY OF EDMONDS INTERLOCAL AGREEMENT FOR MEE
PARKLAND ACQUISITION
7. HANKINS PB APPOINTMENT CONFIRMATION
8. LI PB APPOINTMENT CONFIRMATION
9. REID ESCC APPOINTMENT CONFIRMATION
10. STINE ADB APPOINTMENT CONFIRMATION
11. HENKES EAC APPOINTMENT CONFIRMATION
12. 2023 TRANSPORTATION IMPACT FEE ANNUAL REPORT
13. APPROVAL OF 5-FT DEDICATION FOR 98TH AVE W RIGHT-OF-WAY ADJACENT
TO 22214 98TH AVE W
14. APPROVAL OF PROFESSIONAL SERVICES AGREEMENT FOR KPG/PSOMAS TO
PROVIDE DESIGN ENGINEERING SERVICES FOR THE PHASE 5 STORM UTILITY
REPLACEMENT/REHABILITATION PROJECT
15. COUNCIL RULES OF PROCEDURE SECTION 8
16. COUNCIL RULES OF PROCEDURE - SECTION 13
9. COUNCIL BUSINESS
1. POTENTIAL ACTION ON CRITICAL AQUIFER RECHARGE AREA CODE
AMENDMENT
Mayor Rosen relayed staff planned to display motions and amendments on the screen in real time.
Senior Planner Mike Clugston introduced Senior Utilities Engineer Mike De Lilla and Planning &
Development Director Susan McLaughlin. Mr. Clugston explained this agenda item related to the CARA
code which has been under review for the past year in collaboration with Olympic View Water and Sewer
District (OVWSD). Staff does not have any new information to present tonight; everything was in the
packet. Staff is requesting council vote to adopt the draft ordinance in the packet with no substantive
changes. The ordinance represents best available science (BAS) uncovered over the past year, and is
consistent with and exceeds Department of Health and Department of Ecology standards. The critical area
ordinance is updated every eight years. If the council adopts the draft ordinance tonight, this and other
critical area chapters will need to be updated consistent with BAS in several years. As Mr. De Lilla stated
previously, the stormwater portion will be updated as the Department of Ecology gets new information on
new contaminates, for example PFAS, and the City would immediately adopt any new Ecology regulations
via this ordinance.
Councilmember Nand referred to 23.60.030 regulated activities stormwater (packet page 174), commenting
the point of most controversy is A.2.a, All new bored, drilled, or driven shaft UICs for stormwater
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April 16, 2024
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management purposes are prohibited. During the last presentation it seemed Mr. De Lilla anticipated any
new infiltration would be quite shallow to ensure rainwater wouldn’t be swamped. She asked how far into
the aquifer this code would allow infiltration and did he anticipate it would allow PFAS into the CARA
more quickly. Mr. De Lilla answered as far as ground water is concerned, no infiltration system is allowed
to directly discharge into the aquifer. The distance from the actual aquifer is probably hundreds of feet.
Ecology uses the term UIC well, in layman’s terms, it is really an infiltration system. Ecology has a list of
approved technologies; UICs are the vast majority of the approved technologies to help mitigation and
infiltrate stormwater. Approving the previous version at the planning board would limit the City to only
one way to try to solve problem, but would probably lead to surface flooding, much less buildable area,
take water off site so it literally goes into Deer Creek which does not solve the problem; instead of decades
for the water to get there, it is a matter of minutes. Infiltration would be shallow and it would not inject into
the groundwater; the groundwater is 100s of feet down.
Mr. De Lilla continued, although they say there are areas with exposed QVA, per the report the areas that
are not exposed drain to the exposed portions so it is really the entire CARA that goes into that exposed
water. The discussion about doing one versus the other does not make a lot of sense. This is just for
developed lots; it does not include existing lots which will stay the same and will not be retrofitted. With
regard to PFAS, some level of development is desirable so some work can be done. To restrict what is
allowed will result in less development and things will continue to be infiltrated the old fashioned way
which has absolutely no treatment.
Councilmember Nand relayed Mr. Danson seemed to suggest that the critical area designation might not be
comprehensive enough to protect the CARA. She asked if there was anything more that could be done with
special permitting in this area to restrict what is allowed into the CARA. Mr. De Lilla answered not that he
was aware of; this has been coordinated with Department of Ecology and Department of Health to get their
buy-in and it is as stringent as it can be short of making stormwater drinkable. The available technologies
to deal with PFAS are activated carbon and reverse osmosis; there is no other technology.
Councilmember Eck referred to audience comments which included requests not to make changes and to
adopt the 2023 code. She asked staff to share the implications to the City of doing that versus making the
changes requested tonight. Mr. Lilla answered it would more than likely limit development so the footprint
of what would be allowed would be much larger since everything would be at the surface. He was sure
there would be legal ramifications and very unhappy people who were unable to develop which he saw as
a big minus. If the council adopts what was proposed by planning board, there is a menu of approved
technologies to do mitigation and pollution removal, standards that Ecology allows, that are measured
according to metrics, etc. Otherwise, there is only one way to do it, treatment is on the surface in a grassy
area and everything else is bad even though it is only about 1-2 feet below surface. He did not see the logic
of not allowing intrusion 1-2 feet into the soil when there are roots and plants in the soil and the runoff can
be in a much smaller footprint so everyone has an equal opportunity to do what they want to their home
such as an addition, deck, etc. If all the treatment has to be at the surface, that hogties development. Some
say no development is good, but actually it’s not because there is no new treatment and everything stays
the way it is which is actually worse. Some development is desirable so there can be mitigation.
Councilmember Tibbott referred to Table 23.60.030.1, a very long list of CARA prohibited and restricted
uses which he found very encouraging because it had been thought through and was a great reference for
anyone doing development. He relayed his understanding that there was a difference between shallow UICs
that utilize infiltration pipes versus very deep UICs and it was his understanding deep UICs would be
prohibited. Mr. De Lilla answered deep UICs are not allowed anywhere. Councilmember Tibbott relayed
his understanding that shallow UICs aid in percolating water from the surface into the soil and from his
perspective, eliminate water running down the street and downhill into wherever. He asked the depth of
shallow UICs. Mr. De Lilla answered three feet at the most; it is well within the root zones so there is plant
life, microbes, etc., that help with mitigation; there is still treatment before it infiltrates. It is not just putting
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water in the ground, the 20-30 technologies approved by DOE would be used for which they have metrics
for treatment. Since nobody knows what technology can deal with PFAS to a level that makes sense, it
would just arbitrarily coming up with something. Councilmember Tibbott summarized shallow UICs would
be allowed, deep UICs would be prohibited. Mr. De Lilla agreed.
Councilmember Dotsch commented she comes from a background of do no harm. She recalled at a planning
board meeting last year someone remarking the City did not even know the Deer Creek CARA existed, so
how is it still clean. She recalled Mr. Clugston mentioned the area is predominantly low density single
family housing. If rainwater hits the ground, it is low risk; rainwater hitting a roof and then the ground has
a 30 times higher risk. If density is increased to 3 units/lot, the idea of rainwater hitting a roof is multiplied
instead of hitting the ground and having setbacks. She recalled former Stormwater Engineer Jerry Shuster
talking about having quality setbacks. She was trying to understand if density was the goal at the risk of
clean water because density will increase the chances of rain hitting PFAS in roofs and gutters and then
going into ground and into the aquifer. She asked why change those areas to higher density. Mr. De Lilla
answered because none of that is currently being treated.
Mr. Clugston responded while the density question will come up over the next year or so, that is not the
point of this ordinance. This ordinance is related to management of the two CARAs. There has been
discussion about prohibiting some activities and regulating stormwater in a rational way. Density is a topic
for 2024 and 2025, tonight is consideration of the CARA ordinance.
Councilmember Dotsch pointed out the CARA is related to land use. Mr. Clugston said no land uses are
changing with this ordinance. Councilmember Dotsch said there are discussions about changing land use
in the future. If there is no contamination now and the City is blessed with two CARAs, the City should be
doing the most possible to maintain that. The City has a history of annexing areas and doing nothing related
to infrastructure. She questioned why improvement would be expected by increasing density. There is talk
about stormwater mixing with wastewater all over Edmonds now during weather events and the aquifer is
literally sand. She was trying to figure out the City’s priorities. On Earth Day, the City is talking about
clean air and clean water, so why would the City put itself in a situation with insufficient stormwater
cleanup.
Ms. McLaughlin explained growth and environmental protection are not at odds. The City is supporting
density, complying with the state mandate, providing housing affordability and also protecting clean water.
The draft code goes above and beyond and provides a nimble response to any regulation in the near future.
There will be continued analysis at the federal and regional level that will inform OVWSD to make changes
in their treatment as well as inform what can be done at the local level. She summarized the City is nimble,
responsive, supporting density and actually protecting the environment and water quality. Just because
density is being increased, one cannot assume that will multiply roof surface, the same size house can
provide two units based on average square footage of average single family homes these days. She
summarized density did not always mean a bigger footprint.
Councilmember Dotsch commented ADUS can be 2,400 square feet which is pretty big. The aquifer is
clean now, the area is low density, and although there are issues with flooding, this will not fix the
stormwater issue. She was trying to understand why not do the things that would be the most protective.
Mr. De Lilla answered it was either allowing one tool, or 30 ways to do it. None of these tools have been
studied for removal of PFAS. There is some anecdotal efficiency, but no one knows exactly what that is
and it needs to be studied. At the same time, things like PFOS and PFOA have been banned since the early
2000s. It is just question of what is actually in the environment. The feds are doing their job, seeing what
they can get rid of. Everyone wants all the answers right now; this has been a problem since the 1930s-
1940s and is being worked on. There is no way anyone in this room can do all that science, decisions need
to be based on existing science instead of fear. Great progress is being made, for example 3M stopping
making anything that contains PFAS. Department of Ecology came out with regulations for food packaging.
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The work is being done based on BAS. There may be missteps here and there, but it is trending in the right
direction. At the same time, limiting technologies would be a disservice. The City doesn’t want to say a
raingarden is the only solution which ignores all the other potential tools. The planning board was not given
the full picture that there are many other technologies. Everyone uses the term shallow UIC well, in every
other engineering stormwater design guidance, those are called piped infiltration system. Water mains use
PVC; about 5% of OVWSD’s water mains are PVC which no one is talking about. In his opinion, limiting
the toolkit to one solution was a grave mistake.
Councilmember Chen observed Mr. De Lilla talked about pros and cons and the 2023 ordinance versus the
code proposed today. He observed previously the City did not have any CARA codes. Mr. De Lilla agreed.
Councilmember Chen observed this is the City’s first step to regulate and protect the aquifer resources. Mr.
De Lilla agreed. Councilmember Chen observed there are three approaches the council can take, 1) not
adopt any code and leave things the way they are, 2) adopt the 2023 code which is more restrictive and
prohibits any UICs, or 3) adopt the code in tonight’s packet which allows shallow UIC for infiltration
purposes. Mr. De Lilla said he would not call the 2023 more restrictive, he would call it less restrictive
because it limited the mitigation technologies and allows flows to go directly to Deer Creek and other areas.
It is more restrictive in the sense it did not allow the technology.
Councilmember Chen observed it was more restrictive because it did not allow any UIC at all. Mr. De Lilla
agreed, it did not allow that type of treatment. It was less restrictive, not more restrictive, because it was
saying that one technology was the answer to fix everything for which there is absolutely no science. That
was proposed in 2023, the change was what the planning board had asked for based on incomplete
information. Councilmember Chen relayed his understanding that technologies are evolving as new
technologies come out. Mr. De Lilla agreed, Ecology’s TAPE program lists all the mitigation technologies;
if the City is saying only one technology can be used, the City cannot defend itself against future possible
incoming technologies.
Councilmember Chen referred to Mr. De Lilla’s comment that this has been a problem since the 1930s and
1940s. De Lilla said that is how long PFAS has been around. Councilmember Chen asked if there was any
value in delaying adoption of a CARA code and waiting to see if newer technologies come up. Mr. De Lilla
answered he did not see any value in that; he saw value in using Ecology’s TAPE program, the menu of
technologies and new technologies that will be added in the future. If no UICs are allowed, none of those
technologies are allowed because they need to go in a catch basin in a pipe; as soon as there is a pipe, it’s
not allowed. He did not know of any storm drain system that was completely pipeless.
Council President Olson said she has had discussion with the public and experts including Mr. Danson and
City staff on this subject. She read this agenda item carefully, a lot of it was scientific sourced from Ecology.
She recalled an exercise at a recent council retreat where councilmembers were asked their priorities and
the most important things that could not be neglected when considering budget cuts; first on her list was
clean water. She has been told the council needs to err on the conservative when it comes to what is done
in CARAs. Anything can be taken to an extreme and the suggestions being made are of that nature. For
example, everyone in the CARA could be asked to move out and provide a one mile berth which would be
more protective. When looked at specifics in the appendix by scientific agencies, the one she paid the most
attention to or that resonated with her the most was from Ecology. There are some things that should be
done on an environmental front with regard to the CARA and making residents and businesses in those
areas partners in protecting the CARA such as not washing cars in the driveway, and not using pesticides
and herbicides.
Council President Olson referred to Edmonds’ moratorium on crumb rubber, recalling the documentation
said crumb rubber was super dangerous for CARAs and it should not be used as a filler on turf if it washes
into the CARA. She suggested crumb rubber be an express prohibition in the CARA code. She appreciated
that as science, awareness and standards improve, they will automatically be incorporated into the City’s
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code without this time consuming process. There was wonderful collaboration by many parties and she
thanked them for being engaged in the process. With the caveat of expressly prohibiting crumb rubber, she
was supportive of the code as proposed and suggested it go to consent if council was willing to make that
change.
Ms. McLaughlin referred to an email from Mr. Clugston which stated the moratorium on crumb rubber had
been lifted; that may be something the council wants to add as a future agenda item. Mr. Clugston advised
the crumb rubber moratorium expired in 2020; at this time crumb rubber can be used on any publicly owned
sports fields. Council President Olson asked if there were any publicly owned sports fields in the CARA.
Mr. Clugston answered yes, the playfields at the old Woodway High School and at Madrona School.
COUNCIL PRESIDENT OLSON MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER TIBBOTT, TO
PASS THE CARA CODE IN THE PACKET ON A FUTURE CONSENT AGENDA.
COUNCIL PRESIDENT OLSON MOVED, SECONDED BY COUNCILMEMBER TIBBOTT, TO
AMEND TO ADD A PROVISION THAT THERE WOULD BE NO CRUMB RUBBER IN THE
CARA OR THE CARA BUFFERS.
Mr. Clugston suggested adding “crumb rubber in publicly owned athletic fields” under Use/Activity and
under CARA restriction, add “prohibited in all CARA.” Council President Olson asked if crumb rubber
could be prohibited on private property as well. Mr. Clugston answered in theory, yes. Council President
Olson said she wanted to have that happen.
Councilmember Nand expressed support for the main motion but not the amendment. It was great that the
council was having a public discussion about the use of certain chemicals in the City. For example, she
doesn’t like it when she saw her neighbors using Glyphosate in their lawns because it is a neurotoxin and
the grates on City streets say Puget Sound starts here. She envisioned Glyphosate would be banned one
day. Targeting the use of crumb rubber, especially not knowing existing conditions in the CARA would be
unfairly targeting existing homeowners. She questioned what restrictions that would be placed on new
development because it was her understanding with new development, underground infiltration-capturing
systems would potentially remove more PFAS and other harmful chemicals from the environment.
Councilmember Nand continued, this on the fly, last minute amendment regarding crumb rubber was too
reactionary for her to support. She was in favor of a citywide ban on toxins that harm human, animals and
the environment and would be happy to explore that further with the community, but did not want to confine
that to only the CARA. It would make more sense if it were critical area, etc., but that would need to go
through a public process through the planning board to have a better understanding of how it would impact
property owners.
Councilmember Paine expressed her support for the main motion and the amendment related to crumb
rubber. She recalled the moratorium on crumb rubber expired during the pandemic and never rose to the
top to be addressed again. She agreed there needed to be a citywide moratorium on crumb rubber. She asked
if the technology that will be forthcoming would address other harmful chemicals to the water systems. For
example, tire dust that kills salmon, 6PPD, is not regulated and other things such as legacy chemicals and
new things that come up. She wanted to ensure the City was as nimble as possible with regard to technology
and remediation. Mr. De Lilla said that is why the ordinance proposes the code be changed as science comes
in which will allow it to be nimble instead of coming to council with every change. Ecology is actively
studying things such as 6PPD that is affecting salmon. He was unsure of the timeline, but as soon as
standards were developed, the City would automatically adopt them.
Councilmember Paine relayed her understanding the way the code is written is as flexible as it needs to be
to protect the environment. Mr. De Lilla agreed, relaying in many ways it exceeds what Ecology requires.
Ecology has standards for residential units, the City’s standards increase the amount of treatment provided.
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Councilmember Paine opined this an educational process for the community, because it is not just tire dust,
but things people put on their lawn, put in their laundry, etc.
With regard to the crumb rubber amendment, Councilmember Tibbott assumed that would apply to new
installations, not current installations, and asked that the prohibition be written to reflect that. Mr. Clugston
answered as described in the code, existing uses would be allowed to continue, new uses of crumb rubber
would be prohibited. Councilmember Tibbott expressed support for the amendment and the ordinance in
the packet.
Councilmember Chen agreed with the spirit of the amendment as crumb rubber was a dangerous substance,
but agreed a broader ordinance was needed that would apply citywide, not just in this defined area. He
agreed with the spirit of the amendment, but preferred an approach that would have a bigger impact. He did
not support the amendment, but would support a conversation with the entire community.
Councilmember Eck commented the council’s job is to deal with complexity so she supported the
amendment because it is more protective of the environment and includes crumb rubber. She expressed
interest in renewing the moratorium on crumb rubber throughout the City. She supports the ordinance
because it keeps the City in sync with science and updates the code as the technology, innovation, and
science gets sharper.
Council President Olson pointed out the source for her amendment, page 166 of the OVWSD Water Supply
Protection Guidelines which prohibit tire crumb rubber. Having a citywide moratorium on crumb rubber
might be something for the council to consider, but the council is very busy and it is not on the extended
agenda. She favored protecting the CARA and drinking water now and potentially considering a citywide
prohibition in the future.
AMENDMENT CARRIED (5-2) COUNCILMEMBERS CHEN AND NAND VOTING NO.
MAIN MOTION AS AMENDED CARRIED (6-1) COUNCILMEMBER DOTSCH VOTING NO.
2. FITCH REPORT: FIRE SERVICES FEASIBILITY ASSESSMENT
William Sturgeon, Senior Associate and Project Team Leader, Fitch & Associates, explained he modified
the presentation in the packet for clarity and brevity and included more high level math to explain the
process based on briefings done with groups of councilmembers last week. He reviewed:
• Introduction
o Fitch and Associates Edmonds Project Team
Steve Knight, Ph.D., Partner
William Sturgeon, MPA, EFO, CPM, ICMA-CM, Senior Associate- Lead Project Manager
Dave Johnsen, MBA, EFO, CFO, NRP, Senior Consultant
Bruce Moeller, Ph.D., Senior Consultant
Dan Gorton, MS, NRP, Consultant
o Purpose of the Presentation
Provide the City of Edmonds Council options to make an informed decision on continuing
to provide a high level of emergency services to the citizens of the community.
Goals of the project:
- Emergency services must support the existing and growing needs of the community.
- Emergency services must operationally be citizen centric.
- Emergency services must foster fiscal trust within the community.
• Finding the Right Balance
Edmonds City Council Approved Minutes
April 16, 2024
Page 10
• High Risk Occupancies
o Edmonds includes more than 19,471 housing units and more than 1,642 non-residential
occupancies, including office, professional services, retail/wholesale sales, restaurants/bars,
hotels/motels, churches, schools, government facilities, healthcare facilities, and other non-
residential uses. Commercial occupancies are classified as (Low, Moderate, High, and
Maximum).
• Critical Facilities in Edmonds
o South County Fire identified 155 critical facilities throughout the service area, 28 of which are
located in Edmonds. A hazard occurrence with significant impact severity affecting one or
more of these facilities would likely adversely impact critical public or community services.
• City of Edmonds: All calls 2019-2023 (FITCH)
o Number of Calls Dispatched by Program, Call Type and Reporting Period
• Service Type Calls
Busy time, or time on task, was measured from unit
dispatch date and time to unit clear date and time.
All units assigned to South County Fire for the City
of Edmonds made 6,147 responses and were busy on
calls for a total of 6,042 hours.
The department ran an average of 16.8 calls for
emergency services a day.
86.2% of the total call volume was requests for EMS.
Data retrieved from South County Fire Annual Report to City of Edmonds April 2024
Edmonds City Council Approved Minutes
April 16, 2024
Page 11
• Call Volume – 3.01% annual increase in calls
• Importance of fire and EMS services in Edmonds, WA
• Current resources in Edmonds – 3 fire stations
o Fitch considers this a lean response model.
o Engines – 3
Personnel per unit – 3
o Medic/Aid units – 3-5
Personnel per unit – 2
o Water Rescue Boat
Located at Port of Edmonds
• South County Fire – Current Deployment Model
o Effective Response Force (ERF)
Edmonds City Council Approved Minutes
April 16, 2024
Page 12
• The Fitch team assessed all possible outcomes to fulfill the purpose of the project. Four options
were analyzed; three options presented themselves as the best options to analyze emergency
services for the community.
o Separating Fire and Contracting out for EMS
• FITCH-Financial Comparison of Options Based on Current Level of Service (LOS)
Edmonds City Council Approved Minutes
April 16, 2024
Page 13
• Estimated Capital and Start-up Costs
• Summary of Projected Costs and Savings
Edmonds City Council Approved Minutes
April 16, 2024
Page 14
• Annexation into the RFA Pros and Cons
Pros Cons
Must be voter approved
Maintains level of fire & emergency
services.
Paramedic ambulances
Skilled all hazards response
Fire Marshal
Community Paramedicine
Level of service is governed by elected
fire commission- not the City of Edmonds
• Contracting with Shoreline Fire Rescue
o The Fitch team met with the Fire Chief of Shoreline Fire Department to assess the level of
interest in entering a service contract with The City of Edmonds to provide Fire and EMS
services.
o Due to the City of Edmonds being surrounded by South County Fire response area, Shoreline
Fire Department is the only logical service available for emergency response.
Many variables within this scenario provide uncertainty and the future cost to the City of
Edmonds including debt service, replacement capital funding, and labor rates.
No formal request has been made to Shoreline Fire/EMS from the City of Edmonds.
Pros Cons
Shoreline is a professional all-hazards
department that provides services like
SCF.
Shoreline Fire already has an inter-local
agreement with Northshore to provide Fire
and EMS services
Annual cost
Would require an interlocal agreement
approved by several governing boards.
Initial capital purchases and renovation of
facilities.
Hiring personnel (labor shortage)
Ordering fire apparatus (20-36 months)
• Forming Edmonds Fire Rescue Based on Current LOS
o In 2009, the City of Edmonds dissolved its Fire Department, sold its assets, and merged its
personnel to Snohomish County Fire Protection District NO. 1 (South County Fire).
o For the City to continue to provide the same level of service as it is currently receiving, It will
require 51 operational personnel* and five (5) administrative/ support positions for a total of
56 FTEs
o There is a myriad options based on the acceptable level of risk in a community.
o Estimated Capital and Start-up Costs
Pros Cons
Citizens have direct input via the city
council on level of service.
Initial and ongoing costs.
Recruiting, retaining, and hiring qualified
personnel.
Edmonds City Council Approved Minutes
April 16, 2024
Page 15
The City would need to purchase
apparatus, radios, equipment, and
firefighter protective gear.
New apparatus is currently taking 20-36
months for delivery
• Station and Staffing Models
• Considerations for Reduced Stations and Staffing Models
Average Calls per Day
o A minimum of 3 resources are needed
to handle current call volume
o [Stations (3) x 1.10= 3.3 Resources]
o Average of 16.8 calls per day
o A “One Station Model” would significantly impact RESPONSE TIMES
o Add info from recording
o Reliability of units (available for the next call)
o Effective response force (ERF) – EMS-ALS (3-5 personnel), residential structure fire (14-22
personnel)
o Critical tasks (fire-EMS moderate risk, high risk and max risk calls)
o Reliance on mutual aid when units are tied up (could be a service charge per month)
o Stations would have to be optimized (relocated $$) for maximum effectiveness
• Implementation
Edmonds City Council Approved Minutes
April 16, 2024
Page 16
Councilmember Tibbott referred to the slide regarding high risk occupancies (packet page 212) which
indicates there are 109 total high risk occupancy buildings in the City spread fairly evenly in the response
zone of the City’s three stations. He asked if that was a good thing. Mr. Sturgeon answered in looking at a
risk model, that is a good balance.
Councilmember Tibbott referred to the next slide regarding critical facilities in Edmonds which is not quite
as well balanced. He recalled Mr. Sturgeon mentioning if one or more stations were occupied with a call,
there would likely be adverse impacts. He asked Mr. Sturgeon to elaborate on that. Mr. Sturgeon said he
was referring to something happening to critical infrastructure such as a power station, a substation, the
waste water treatment plant, information technology hubs, city hall, etc. which would impact the entire
City. Councilmember Tibbott relayed his understanding if 1-2 stations were occupied on a call, that could
theoretically have an adverse impact on the ability to respond to another call. Mr. Sturgeon agreed,
explaining with 1-2 stations, there is no depth. He assured there would be a response via mutual aid, but if
the City’s 1-2 stations were occupied, assistance would come from the next closest station such as Shoreline,
or SCF which would result in a longer response and things escalating during that time.
Councilmember Tibbott observed the adverse effects would be longer response and potentially not enough
personnel at least immediately. Mr. Sturgeon referred to the 4-9 minute EMS window for saving brain and
heart tissue and managing a structure fire to limit the economic impact on a family or the community.
Councilmember Tibbott summarized it appeared three stations were somewhat essential for covering the
whole City and being prepared for potential adverse situations. Mr. Sturgeon agreed.
Councilmember Nand thanked Mr. Sturgeon for the time he took to meet with councilmembers individually
prior to this presentation. She appreciated his confirmation that option 1 would be the most affordable.
When the RFA was created, the rationale to the cities in Snohomish County who initially joined was there
would be a cost savings to administrative consolidation. With regard to option 2, she recalled him saying
several interlocal agreements (ILA) would be required to contract with Shoreline Fire up to a King County
board and asked if that would be the King County Council. Mr. Sturgeon relayed his understanding that
Edmonds City Council Approved Minutes
April 16, 2024
Page 17
Shoreline is contracted by Medic 1 King County to provide fire and EMS and is a special fire district so
their board would have to vote. Due to King County EMS’s involvement, the City would have to pay King
County’s levy rate and King County would have to approve that. He did not think that would be a heavy
lift, but it could be political. Councilmember Nand said she has heard that from friends in Shoreline that
taxpayers are taxed at a different rate for EMS and fire than Snohomish County so Edmonds would have to
make up that difference because they would not subsidize Edmonds. Mr. Sturgeon agreed, commenting that
is why Shoreline is more expensive in the analysis.
Councilmember Nand said she is on the Sno911 board and remembered seeing in the contract for Motorola
radios that Sno911 was able to negotiate for replacement batteries, etc. due to the volume. She asked if
Edmonds as a 2-3 fire station entity would lose the ability to negotiate with vendors based on volume. Mr.
Sturgeon answered yes, likely the ability to negotiate special incentives would be lost although he assured
everything was negotiable. Councilmember Nand commented this has been a high profile issue politically
in Edmonds for a long time and she appreciated his data driven discussion regarding the options.
Councilmember Paine pointed out Mr. Sturgeon’s work history also includes working as a city manager in
the past as well as in other aspects of public safety which is reflected in his well-rounded presentation. She
noted the Implementation and the Summary of Projected Costs and Savings slides were not in the packet.
She thanked Mr. Sturgeon for looking at the LEOFF1 and LEOFF2 cost savings if the City joined the RFA.
She asked about the timeline for training firefighter/EMS personnel. Mr. Sturgeon answered personnel are
already qualified as Firefighter 1 and 2 and EMS/EMT/paramedic. The City would need to determine how
many were needed based on the level of service. The challenge is to learn the newly written policies and
procedures which is classroom work, rote memory, etc. Then there needs to be training on hands-on skills
as a team. Personnel come qualified from the fire academy but the team has to learn to work together with
new supervisors, etc. Personnel would also need to familiarize themselves with occupancies within the City,
learn routes, hydrant and system locations, etc. He estimated a 4-6 month day schedule for that training.
Any good fire department will also learn the mutual aid area.
Councilmember Paine recalled Mr. Sturgeon saying in the Shoreline option, Edmonds would be in third
position, contracting with a contractor so the City would not have a lot of authority. Mr. Sturgeon agreed it
would water down the City’s authority. Councilmember Paine agreed it would be Edmonds versus King
County. She requested he send the council the Implementation and the Summary of Projected Costs and
Savings slides. Mr. Sturgeon advised he will send the entire presentation to the clerk.
Councilmember Chen commented the presentation provided a very clear comparison of the three options.
In looking at the South County RFA versus Shoreline, he asked if the firefighters’ schedules was similar.
Mr. Sturgeon answered he did not know Shoreline’s schedule. He offered to find out and email
Councilmember Chen. Councilmember Chen observed in looking at the cost comparison, the cost to annex
into South County Fire RFA is approximately $18 million, Edmonds’ current cost via the contract with SCF
is approximately $12 million in 2024. He asked about the difference in cost. Mr. Sturgeon answered Fitch
used the RFA’s budget to determine the cost; one of the reasons SCF wants to cancel the contract with
Edmonds and get Edmonds to join the RFA is they do not believe the contractual amount the City is paying
covers their costs. The first time Fitch met with SCF, he asked what it cost to run Edmonds fire stations and
the fire chief said $17.7 million/year. When Fitch did the math, it was $17.8 million which includes
personnel, services, operational costs, etc. He pointed out SCF’s value added services such as their
paramedicine program, community paramedics, fire prevention, public education, training academy, etc. If
Edmonds went with a barebones fire department, there wouldn’t be fire prevention, the City would still
have to have a fire marshal, plans review of fire protection systems, inspections, etc.
Councilmember Chen said one of contributing factors is the $1.25/$1,000 AV formula. When the same rate
is applied in a community where property values are much higher like Edmonds compared to some other
communities in the RFA, the cost is much higher. He suggested one of the points of negotiation could be
Edmonds City Council Approved Minutes
April 16, 2024
Page 18
adjusting the formula so Edmonds pays a fair rate instead of paying a heavier burden. Mr. Sturgeon agreed
that would need to be figured out and negotiated. He said Councilmember Chen was referring to equity
across the district, how to make it equitable so Edmonds was not covering costs of communities with lower
property values. Councilmember Chen commented it was not fair for other communities to bear Edmonds’
costs and vice versa. Mr. Sturgeon said he has never seen a totally fair way of doing that, but as he has said,
everything is negotiable and that is the reason for entering into negotiations. It is not a done deal if the
council passes a resolution to annex into the RFA; there are things that still have to be negotiated. The
parties could reach an impasse and be unable to move forward. Councilmember Chen summarized a lot of
details have to be negotiated. Mr. Sturgeon agreed this analysis was high level; the devil is in the details.
Councilmember Eck appreciated Mr. Sturgeon’s and Fitch’s objective view in looking at this from an
unbiased lens and bringing their expertise to this. She asked about the average days to hire, recalling the
trend across the country that these positions are difficult to fill. Mr. Sturgeon said he did not have an
average, he just knew it would be a heavy lift. He was not saying it couldn’t happen but the City would
need to incentivize, and pay at least comparable to other agencies and provide comparable benefits. He
could not provide an average number of days to hire as it would depend on how much was invested in
recruiting, marketing, etc. Some people might want to come to a start-up department, but it would be a
difficult lift.
Council President Olson thanked Mr. Sturgeon for his willingness to make a public presentation that
reflected the council’s input. For the sake of the public, she assured the council is still taking input and
information. If there is something the public sees or hears that is important to this conversation, she
encouraged them to inform the council and/or the administration. She often hears consulting is done to
reaffirm the original choice, but the council has told Fitch repeatedly that that is not the council’s mindset,
the council really wants to know all the options and everything that is entailed in order to make the best
decision for the community.
Council President Olson explained one of the inputs from the community was whether formation of a
smaller RFA with Edmonds and Woodway was a possible option. The council has spoken to Fitch about
that option and she invited Mr. Sturgeon to comment on it. Mr. Sturgeon said it was a great question in
trying to figure out the best path forward. The same things that apply to Shoreline and starting a new
department exist such as the difficult hiring and purchasing apparatus. In his view of that scenario, Edmonds
would be putting themselves in the position of being the big dog on the block, funding the equipment, etc.
and responding to Woodway who pays $600,000/year now. It is an option, but high level, it would also be
a difficult lift. Council President Olson commented one of distinctions that differs from Edmonds having
its own department is the separate jurisdiction for taxation, it would not fall under the General Fund which
is a significant distinction between the options.
Councilmember Dotsch asked Mr. Sturgeon to explain the cons related to annexation to RFA that the level
of service is governed by the elected fire commission. Mr. Sturgeon answered if the City passed a resolution
to annex into the RFA, the City would appoint a non-voting member to their board until a fire commissioner
was elected to represent the district that includes Edmonds. Councilmember Dotsch asked if there was a
standard LOS that the RFA abides by or could they just say Edmonds is further out and the response would
take longer. Mr. Sturgeon answered not that he knew of; the fire commission is governed by the laws of the
State of Washington. Councilmember Dotsch asked if there was any ability to negotiate the level of service.
Mr. Sturgeon reiterated everything is negotiable including the possibility of having another representative
from the Edmonds area. His only experience with that was several years ago he was able to negotiate an
extra seat and an ex officio member when a community’s utilities were turned over to a regional water
authority. He summarized there are options and he recommended considering an ex officio member who
although they do not vote, could provide a voice.
Edmonds City Council Approved Minutes
April 16, 2024
Page 19
Councilmember Nand referred to the information provided regarding timelines; in option 1 completing
annexation would take 18-24 months, option 2 contracting with Shoreline would take 24-30 months, and
option 3 reforming Edmonds’ independent fire department would take 36 months. The RFA informed
Edmonds last year they were pulling the contract for service and gave the City a two year timeline to entirely
terminate service to Edmonds. Following on discussion at last week’s Finance Committee, she stressed it
incumbent on the council and administration to quickly put the question about annexation to the voters so
they can inform the City of their decision. If they reject annexation, then the City will need to quickly
explore options 2 and 3. When negotiating millions of dollars, the City does not want to be at the end of the
rope in negotiations, but should have a lot of time for such major negotiations. To do a good service for
community members, especially property tax payers, it is incumbent on the council and administration to
put the ballot question to Edmonds voters as soon as possible and coordinate town halls, etc. with the fire
chief who offered to participate prior to pulling the City’s contract.
Councilmember Chen said he appreciated the conversation on this important decision the City is about to
make. Putting himself in SCF’s shoes, they have structures, equipment and personnel in place serving
Edmonds; if they discontinue service to Edmonds, they would have excess resources. So another option
would be to come to the table with a win-win solution for both parties, continue a contract format, but
increase the fee between $12 million and $17 million. Mr. Sturgeon said Fitch would be happy to continue
to partner with Edmonds and advocate for Edmonds. He agreed the RFA would have excess equipment.
Buying used fire trucks is an option, but they are usually junk and if the City bought trucks from the RFA
to establish its department, they could be at 5-10 years of service life and quickly reaching end of life. The
City would need to have a replacement cycle and there are criteria for replacing apparatus. The rule of
thumb is first run 7 years, 7-15 years as reserve apparatus and then replacement. Funds need to be budgeted
for replacement of apparatus as well as SCBAs, radios, etc. He reiterated everything is negotiable and Fitch
could be an advocate for the City during that process.
Councilmember Dotsch referred to the RFA’s notification of intent to end the contract and asked Mr.
Sturgeon to speak to the City not having any fire service. Mr. Sturgeon said he asked SCF’s fire chief if
they would leave Edmonds leave high and dry and his response was no, of course not. It would be immoral
to leave a city without fire service due to the impact on people’s lives and he did not think anyone in good
conscience would do that and he was told SCF would not.
Councilmember Nand commented while SCF might not end service in Edmonds after the contract ends,
Edmonds would likely pay through the nose for service from them until renegotiations occur which is just
an academic exercise. SCF pulled everyone’s contracts in Snohomish County because they want everyone
to annex into the RFA or find fire service elsewhere. The City has to be forward thinking and responsible
to community members, especially property tax payers and coordinate with the RFA and put the ballot
question to the voters as quickly as possible. The annexation process will take 18-24 months, contracting
with Shoreline, even if the various bodies approve the ILAs, will take 24-36 months. People from Shoreline
have already indicated they will not subsidize fire service for Edmonds when they are paying King County’s
higher tax rate. Restarting the City’s own fire department will take 36 months. She feared the City’s costs
would go through the roof during an 18 month period without a contract with SCF or without being annexed
into the RFA which she found very irresponsible.
Mr. Sturgeon advised he will submit Fitch’s final report by next Friday at 3 pm.
10. EXECUTIVE SESSION TO DISCUSS PENDING OR POTENTIAL LITIGATION, RCW
42.30.110(1)(I)
At 8:59 pm, the Council convened in executive session to discuss pending or potential litigation per RCW
42.30.110(1)(i) for a period of 45 minutes.
Edmonds City Council Approved Minutes
April 16, 2024
Page 20
MEETING EXTENSION
At 9:43 pm, Mayor Rosen announced that the executive session would be extended to 9:55 pm.
RECONVENE IN OPEN SESSION
The meeting reconvened at 9:54 p.m.
11. MAYOR'S COMMENTS
12. COUNCIL COMMENTS
ADJOURNMENT
With no further business, the Council meeting was adjourned at 9:54 pm.