06-12-12 Public Safety and Personnel Committe MinutesMinutes
Public Safety and Personnel Committee Meeting
June 12, 2012
Elected Officials Present: Councilmember Joan Bloom
Councilmember Kristiana Johnson
Councilmember Adrienne Fraley-Monillas
Staff Present: Assistant Police Chief Gerry Gannon
Sandy Chase, City Clerk
Jeannie Dines, Recorder
The meeting was called to order at 6:06 p.m. by Councilmember Bloom.
A. Snohomish Regional Drug & Gang Task Force, 2012 — 2013 Interlocal
Agreement
Assistant Police Chief Gannon described the Snohomish Regional Drug & Gang Task Force
(SRDGTF) Interlocal Agreement. In addition to the SRDGTF, he pointed out that Edmonds also
participates in the South Snohomish County Narcotics Task Force with the cities of Lynnwood
and Mountlake Terrace. The two task forces work closely and assist each other with staffing
and equipment. Mr. Gannon requested that the committee approve the placement of the
Interlocal Agreement on the City Council Consent Agenda.
Responding to questions from Councilmember Bloom concerning how the fees are calculated
for the Interlocal Agreement, Mr. Gannon stated the fees are based on population. Edmonds
fee is $9,939 for July 1, 2012 through June 30, 2013 (a decrease of $59 over last year's fee).
Councilmember Johnson had specific questions regarding the agreement which Mr. Gannon
responded to. In particular Councilmember Johnson asked questions pertaining to the
participation of certain cities/entities and why they were listed in the agreement. Mr. Gannon
clarified that the interlocal agreement originates from the Snohomish County Sheriff's Office.
Edmonds' participation is just the funding. He stated that he would provide additional
information following this meeting to further respond to Councilmember Johnson's questions.
Action: Assistant Chief of Police Gannon to provide additional information to the Committee.
The Committee approved placing the agreement on the City Council Consent Agenda.
B. Discussion Regarding Taking Minutes/Notes During Executive Session
Councilmember Bloom suggested in addition to discussing whether to take minutes/notes
during executive session, the discussion include whether executive sessions should be
recorded. She acknowledged there may be some executive sessions that should never be
recorded such as those regarding personnel.
Councilmember Bloom explained Resolution 853 states the Council takes minutes of executive
sessions and at some point the minutes will be available to the public if the reason for the
executive session has expired. The issue is staff takes summary notes which are not approved
by Council so they are not technically minutes.
A discussion with the residents who were present ensued. Their comments included the
following:
Ron Wambolt, Edmonds, asked whether Councilmembers Bloom and Johnson had reviewed
the materials from the Council retreat. Councilmember Johnson said she had and
Councilmember Bloom said she was present at the retreat. Mr. Wambolt pointed out Mr. Reidy
has done a great deal of research regarding this issue.
Ken Reidy, Edmonds, acknowledged this was a complicated issue; taking minutes/notes was
important to him because he believes citizens would get better representation by their elected
officials and more honest government if the City Council and Mayor knew eventually the
minutes of Executive Sessions could be released to the public in certain situations. Resolution
853 requires minutes be kept; if minutes require an audio or video recording, executive sessions
should be recorded. Resolution 853 also addresses the concept of minutes being subject to
release when the reason for the executive session expires. He acknowledged Edmonds is
unique; he was not aware of any other cities that keep executive session minutes. This is an
opportunity to build trust in local governance and for Edmonds to be a leader in transparency.
He hoped the Council would go in that direction rather than to discontinue keeping
minutes/notes.
Diane Talmadge, Edmonds, commented a resolution was non -binding, she preferred the
requirement be contained in an ordinance. She felt tensions build when elected officials know
what occurs in executive sessions and citizens do not. Recording or minutes of executive
sessions would bring tensions into balance and elected officials would be aware that the
minutes could be released at a later date. If there are no recording/notes, executive sessions
seem like secret meetings. The people's right to know is of greater importance than elected
officials' right to discuss it without anyone looking. Ms. Talmadge said executive session
minutes would also allow Councilmembers to refresh their memory if necessary regarding what
was discussed in executive session. She wanted the public and the Council protected because
it ultimately saved the City money.
Damon Pistulka, Edmonds, commented a Councilmember could be presented information in
an executive session that is later contradicted. Without documentation, there is nothing to
substantiate the information provided in executive session. It was beneficial for all parties to
have notes/minutes of executive sessions, especially in litigation. Current and future
Councilmembers could also review notes/minutes of an executive session.
Bruce Witenberg, Edmonds, suggested the City Attorney make a presentation at a Council
meeting similar to the presentation at the retreat, including addressing public comments that
have been made since that presentation. With regard to release of executive session
minutes/notes, he commented that although a litigation or real estate matter may have been
concluded, the City may use the same tactics and strategies in future negotiations/litigation;
having that information made public could be a disadvantage to the City. The reason for the
executive session and the passage of time are not the only criterion for releasing information.
Other issues to consider include preserving the attorney/client privilege in an executive session
and inadvertent disclosure if notes/minutes/recordings are kept of executive sessions. He
suggested the City Attorney's presentation also clarify who is the client in executive sessions.
Mr. Reidy suggested also having a proponent of open government address the City Council in
addition to the City Attorney to provide a balanced viewpoint. Even if executive session minutes
are never released to the public, it is important to have executive sessions recorded and
detailed minutes kept.
Councilmember Bloom asked whether other cities record their executive session. City Clerk
Sandy Chase said Edmonds is the only city she knows of that takes minutes/notes of executive
sessions.
Mr. Reidy noted Resolution 853 was passed on September 16, 1996 on the Consent Agenda;
he asked whether there was any previous discussion. Ms. Chase recalled the City Council was
holding a number of executive sessions at the time and there were similar concerns expressed;
Resolution 853 was a response to the concerns at that time.
Councilmember Bloom referred to SB 6109 which would have required a judge to review the
audio recording if there was a public record request of an executive session to determine if it
was truly necessary to hold an executive session. She asked why the Senate proposed that bill
if other cities do not document their executive session. Ms. Chase stated her understanding that
it may be due to efforts by Washington Coalition for Open Government (WCOG) and others.
Mr. Pistulka commented executive session notes would be helpful regardless of whether they
are released. He cited the example of business board meeting notes that provide useful
information.
Councilmember Johnson observed there is a balance between the public's right/need/desire to
know, risk assessment and the attorney/client privilege. Resolution 853 was a compromise in an
attempt to appease all parties. However, the language in the resolution does not necessarily
reflect the practice. Minutes require approval, notes do not. She suggested determining whether
to modify the resolution or the practice. She supported having a presentation from the City
Attorney on this subject at the full Council.
Councilmember Fraley-Monillas suggested having a presentation from AWC and WCOG as
well. Councilmember Johnson suggested MRSC as an additional resource.
Other topics discussed included increased frequency of executive sessions this year, redaction
of information in executive session minutes, the City Attorney's presence at executive session,
and assessing risk.
Action: At next week's meeting the City Attorney make a presentation, to be followed by
Council discussion with the goal of a future public hearing and further input from AWC, WCOG,
etc.
C. Public Comments
Public comment occurred during Agenda Item B.
Adjourn: 8:21 p.m.