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2003-01-09 Historic Preservation Commission MinutesHISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION MINUTES January 9, 2003 1. CALL TO ORDER AND ROLL CALL The meeting of the Edmonds Historic Preservation Commission was called to order at 3:37 p.m. in the 31 Floor Fourtner Room of City Hall, 121 — 51 Avenue North, by Chair Marmion. PRESENT ABSENT Darrell Marmion, Chair Ed Baker Gregg Arnold, Vice Chair Chuck LeWame Barbara Kindness Michael Plunkett Stephen Waite READING/APPROVAL OF MINUTES STAFF PRESENT Star Campbell, Assistant Planner OTHERS PRESENT Pat Bergsman, Professional Grant Writer COMMISSIONER LEWARNE MOVED TO ADOPT THE MINUTES OF DECEMBER 12, 2002 AS AMENDED. COMMISSIONER KINDNESS SECONDED THE MOTION. THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. 2. ANNOUNCEMENT OF AGENDA There were no changes made to the agenda. 3. REQUESTS FROM THE AUDIENCE There was no one in the audience to address the Commission. 4. PUBLIC HEARINGS There were no public hearings scheduled on the agenda. 5. UNFINISHED BUSINESS There was no unfinished business scheduled on the agenda. 6. SUBCOMMITTEE REPORTS a. Administrative Subcommittee Report Chair Marmion announced that the Historic Preservation Commission Bylaws portion of the Certified Local Government Application was just submitted to the State for review, and the application is now complete. Ms. Campbell advised that the Commission should receive a response within 30 days. She said she would forward any comments she receives to the Commissioners. Councilmember Plunkett advised that all the Priority A tasks that were identified for the Administrative Subcommittee have been accomplished. He referred to the Administrative Subcommittee's task to investigate and report to the Commission on the use of potential funding sources, which is related to grants. He recalled that the Administrative Subcommittee was waiting for additional discussion from the Communications Subcommittee. b. Communication's Subcommittee Report Commissioner Kindness said she has not submitted any additional news releases to the papers, nor has she been able to schedule an appointment with the editor of THE ENTERPRISE, who indicated that he would be very open to including information related to the Historic Preservation Commission in the newspaper on a regular basis. Hopefully, the Communications Subcommittee will be able to schedule this meeting before the next Commission meeting. She said she would work on making sure meeting announcements are published in the future. Councilmember Plunkett suggested that it would be important to meet with the editor of THE ENTERPRISE within the next 30 days so that they will be ready to publish information about the City obtaining Certified Local Government status as anticipated. Commissioner Kindness agreed. Commissioner Kindness said she has been speaking with the grant writer regarding opportunities for funding to publish a brochure, and she should be present later in the meeting to discuss her ideas with the Commission. C. Historic Register Subcommittee Chair Marmion said he had planned to bring his lap top computer to the meeting to show the Commissioners how the State's access database works, but he was unable to do so. He said he would bring it the next month. He said the database would enable each local area to keep track of and maintain their own database, but it could also be uploaded to the State's database. Once the Commission starts working on their inventory, they will use the database as a tool. Commissioner Kindness inquired if there are any State publications that illustrate what other communities are doing as far as CLG Status. Chair Marmion said the only thing he is aware of is the newsletter, which is the States' main channel of communication. Ms. Campbell advised that she has forwarded a copy of the last newsletter to each of the Commissioners. The Commission agreed that it would be helpful and interesting to meet with other jurisdictions that are going through the CLG process to build a type of network of historical societies throughout the State. Ms. Campbell said she received an e- mail from the staff contact for the Snohomish County Historic Preservation Commission indicating that the Edmonds Historic Preservation Commission would be added to their mailing list and notified of future of meeting agendas. Commissioner LeWarne advised that the League of Snohomish County Heritage Organizations also puts out a newsletter, and perhaps this newsletter could include information about the Edmonds Historic Preservation Commission, as well. d. Incentives Subcommittee Commissioner Waite reported that the Incentives Subcommittee has a meeting scheduled for later in the month. Up to this time, they have been focusing on contacting municipalities, but they could also start contacting historic preservation organizations that are not necessarily affiliated with cities. They have contacted the City of Edmonds. too. Although there will not be any money forthcoming, perhaps they can support the process in some other way. He asked that Commissioners provide ideas for how the City might participate in historic preservation. Historic Preservation Commission Minutes January 9, 2003 Page 2 Chair Marmion said he was contacted by the consultant that is doing work for the City of Edmonds related to downtown parking. When he asked what changes could be made, Chair Marmion said he mentioned the opportunity of offering an incentive for saving an older building by allowing some type of relief from the parking requirements. He indicated that he liked the concept and intended to pursue it. Commissioner Waite said that incentives such as the one mentioned by Chair Marmion are things the Commission will be pursuing with the City. Council Member Plunkett said the parking study that is currently in process would result in some recommendations. Perhaps the Incentives Subcommittee should attempt to integrate some historical ideas into the recommendations. When the recommendations are presented, they could identify the historical aspects that are not part of the proposal but could be integrated in. He suggested that Commissioner Waite contact either Duane Bowman or Darrell Smith at the City. Ms. Campbell suggested that the Commission draft a letter providing their input that there should be some breaks for parking when historical structures are being preserved. Commissioner Waite said there are other incentives the Commission could consider, as well. These need to be presented to the City to find out the procedure for pursuing a particular idea. Council Member Plunkett said it seems that the Commission already has ideas about possible incentives, and perhaps it is time to get into a more in-depth discussion of the options. If they agree upon specific incentives, the next step would be to send them forward to the Planning Board for review and a recommendation to the City Council. But he emphasized that now is the time to integrate their incentive ideas that are related to parking so that they can be incorporated into the consultant's recommendation. The Commission agreed that they are ready to start looking at ideas for incentives. Chair Marmion said the City recently received a letter from Natalie Shippen regarding the demolition of the old high school. Her letter was addressed to the Public Facilities District (PFD) and contained ideas for preserving pieces of the building to be used in the construction of some type of memorial. He questioned if there is anything the Commission could do to support this effort. Commissioner LeWarne inquired if the Commission could write a letter to the Public Facilities District in support of Ms. Shippen's idea. Commissioner Waite suggested that because the Commission is not clear as to exactly what their boundaries of authority and responsibility are, perhaps they should have some type of discussion to further clarify. Chair Marmion reminded the Commission that their charter is to encourage, acknowledge and increase awareness of historic preservation. The Commission has the ability to suggest an activity and then back up their suggestion with information about the property indicating why the effort is worthwhile. When the PFD started considering options for the old high school building, the Commission should have provided input. Commissioner LeWarne said he feels it would be within the Commission's responsibility and charter to lend support to an idea such as the one presented by Ms. Shippen. Commissioner Waite agreed because this site could potentially be nominated for the historic register. Chair Marmion suggested that, if nothing else, the Commission should at least provide information about a site or building that is being considered if it has historic significance. If someone presents an idea that could be helped along with Commission support, they should consider becoming involved. Chair Marmion indicated that he would look for language in the ordinance that would support the Commission's response to Ms. Shippen's request and then draft a letter on behalf of the Commission for discussion at the next meeting. Ms. Campbell suggested that it would be helpful for the Commission to know a little bit about the process that would take place to construct the new public facility. This could be provided at the next meeting, as well. The Commission agreed. 7. NEW BUSINESS Commissioner Kindness introduced the Commissioners to Pat Bergsman, a professional grant writer. Each of the Commissioners introduced themselves, as well. Historic Preservation Commission Minutes January 9, 2003 Page 3 Commissioner Kindness said that she has explained to Ms. Bergsman that the Historic Preservation Commission was set up by the City of Edmonds, and they have applied for certified local government status, which apparently is a good move in order to secure grants and other types of funding for projects. Ms. Bergsman said that she typically works with non-profit organizations as opposed to governmental entities. She is spending a fair amount of time working as the development officer for The Little Red School House, and she also does freelance consulting, grant writing, and program development. Because the Commission is a government rather than a private organization, much of the funding from private foundations would not be available to them. She also questioned whether contributions from individuals would be considered tax deductible. Ms. Bergsman said she would like to hear an overview from the Commission as to what they are trying to accomplish, as well as the time frame and associated costs. Commissioner Arnold said his personal view is that the City has sites of historical significance, and that is part of what makes the town attractive and appealing to many. He said he sees two reasons to communicate this to the community. First, there may be citizens who disagree with his personal view. Second, there are likely a lot of people who have apathy, not because they don't care but because they don't have time. They need to do something to rally the citizens and get them excited about the preservation of the historical sites in Edmonds. He suggested that while brochures are one option for doing this, a more effective approach would be to produce a video presentation that could be run on the Edmonds cable channel as a community awareness effort. However, the cost of this video production could be as much as $20,000. Ms. Bergsman inquired regarding the Commission's mission. Commissioner LeWarne answered that it is to encourage the historic preservation of sites and buildings in the City. Ms. Bergsman pointed out that this mission, in itself, it not something that will excite most people. Commissioner LeWarne suggested that historic preservation could become an income producing project for the City because it makes the City more attractive and draws people to it. Ms. Bergsman said that in order for the Commission to make a case statement to a business community, it would be nice to have a plan that states that the Commission specific things they will do and the benefit that business owners could expect from their support. Ms. Bergsman inquired if the Commission has any kind of a game plan at all on what they are going to do. Commissioner Arnold said it is very important to him that Edmonds maintain their historical buildings and sites because that is what creates the character of Edmonds. He added that, to him, it is not a matter of economics. He said he spent more money buying a house in Edmonds than he would have spent somewhere else. He paid to come to Edmonds because of what it has, and he does not have any interest in tearing down the historical stuff to replace it with modern buildings to support economic development. Ms. Bergsman said it is important to reach a balance. There are business owners who have the same kind of feeling as Commissioner Arnold, but they may not have the money available to make it happen. Therefore, it is important for the Commission to look at what types of things appeal to businesses that have the money to contribute to the effort. For example, Port Angeles does very well with their historical tour each year. As a citizen of Edmonds, Ms. Bergsman said she has always thought the City should do more to tout what they have to others. She said she is perfectly willing to let visitors spend their money in Edmonds so that the City can do more to preserve what they have got, which in turn will bring in more people. Ms. Bergsman emphasized that the Commission needs to have some type of plan to identify what they want to do. There has to be some federal dollars for preservation, but unless the Commission has a clear game plan that outlines what they want the outcome to be for the dollars expended, it is really hard to make a case. She pointed out that the Edmonds -South Snohomish County Historical Society is a 5010 organization, and Boeing and others will produce brochures at no cost for 5010 organizations. They will also provide their in-house expertise to help with the design. Perhaps part of her role will be to help the Commission clarify their short and long-term plans. At the same time she can do research on funding opportunities that would fit in with pieces of the plan. Commissioner LeWarne said that one of the tasks the Commission is charged with is establishing a register of historic properties, buildings and sites in Edmonds. The Commission would also be the avenue by which persons who have such sites would place their properties on the State and National Registers. In order to accomplish this, it takes money to do surveys, etc. He envisions the publication of a brochure to inform the public of the Commission's responsibilities as well as what citizens need to do to be on the list of historic sites. Once the City obtains CLG status, there are some State and Federal Historic Preservation Commission Minutes January 9, 2003 Page 4 funds available to them, but this would require submission of a grant proposal. Ms. Bergsman agreed that establishing a register of historical properties would be one piece of the Commission's plan. Ms. Bergsman said that because the Edmonds -South Snohomish County Historical Society raises funds by seeking donations, there are some records available of people who are interested in historic preservation. This same option could be available to the Edmonds Commission once a plan has been established. Ms. Bergsman said the Commission should consider what has worked before. Chair Marmion agreed with Commissioner LeWarne that once the City obtains CLG Status, the Commission would want to apply as soon as they can to the State to obtain some of the grant monies for the inventory. It is important that the inventory be started as soon as possible. Hopefully, this is only a month or two away. Commissioner Kindness suggested they could put together some type of historical tour using a trolley service. This could be included as part of the package, but they would have to determine which governing body would maintain the trolley service. The costs would also have to be determined and an operating budget would have to be set up. Also, a revenue for the on- going budget would have to be identified. Commissioner Arnold said he believes that the underlying reason for putting together the Historic Preservation Commission was because the City Council felt the citizens of Edmonds would benefit from preserving historical sites. If the Commission gets off on tangents, it could be unproductive because there is already a tourism group in town, as well as a downtown retail association. Edmonds is a wonderful community, and he suggested they should try to get the people who live in the community to be the target audience. He questioned if there are foundations that are interested in providing seed money for an organization such as the Commission that would help them get the community to rally together. Ms. Bergsman said they might be able to find some non-profit foundations to fund this type of effort, but not a government body. Commissioner Arnold suggested that perhaps the Commission should build their alliance with the non-profit organization (Edmonds -South Snohomish County Historical Society) so that they have a venue for getting some of their other projects done. Ms. Bergman agreed that in addition to the CLG status, it is important for the Commission to have a connection with a non-profit organization, that can then provide pass through money to them. Commissioner Waite inquired if donors look at their donations as an internal rate of return or if they want to promote historic preservation to benefit future generations. Ms. Bergsman said that while some businesses will be in support of historic preservation just because of the unique character it creates, others will want some type of financial return on their investment. In addition, she noted that a lot of people come to Edmonds because of its unique character. When considering possibilities for funding, they might want to consider the market outside of Edmonds proper, too. Chair Marmion said that it seems that every time they hear discussions about how to preserve the character of the town, they always look at the business owners in the downtown rather than the 25,000 residents that live there, as well. The reason people want to live in the bowl is that they enjoy the sense of community that exists. Commissioner Arnold agreed that both groups need to be recognized. He has seen a lot of the business property owners working to preserve historic sites, but no one has ever really pulled the residents living in the downtown area into the program. The Hyatt Palma study that was conducted a few years ago did not really engage the citizenry of Edmonds, either. Chair Marmion said that he has talked to a lot of people who live in the downtown Edmonds area, and they have expressed disgust with the direction it is currently going. It is turning into three-story condos from lot line to lot line. Over time, it will eventually be too late and the character of Edmonds will be gone. People will then stop moving to Edmonds. Commissioner Arnold said one thing the Commission is struggling with is how they can make an impact. They know they want to preserve historic sites, but they are not sure how to go about it. Ms. Campbell said it is a lot harder than she ever thought it would be to get people involved in projects. Each time they have a new mixed -use building that goes lot line to lot line, they notify everyone within 300 feet. It is advertised in the paper and posted at three public buildings throughout the City. However, not very many people actually attend the Architectural Design Board meeting and provide their input or attend a City Council meeting to express their concerns. Commissioner Arnold agreed that this is a concern. He suggested that perhaps the City needs to figure out what they can do to make it easier for these people to participate in the process. Historic Preservation Commission Minutes January 9, 2003 Page 5 Council Member Plunkett questioned if once they have a program, are the Commissioners, as laymen, capable of identifying the right potential givers and writing grants that will be successful. Or do they really need a professional grant writer? Ms. Bergsman said a professional is not going to have as difficult of a time making sure they are picking the right sources and that they are using the right words. However, sometimes the advantage of a "nonprofessional" doing the work is that the passion really shows though. She suggested that grants are nothing but blueprints. Council Member Plunkett said that if the Commission were to assume the responsibility of writing the grant applications, how could they learn the process and identify potential grant sources. Ms. Bergsman said she would start by looking on the internet under "government." They could use key words such as community development, preservation, and community empowerment. She cautioned that they should look at the types of things that have been funded and for how much. They should also look at how much work they are going to demand for the dollars received. Some grants are not worth going after because they cost too much. Council Member Plunkett inquired regarding a grant writer's fee. Ms. Bergsman said that no reputable grant writer would take a percentage of the grant. The Commission would pay the grant writer on a consultant fee basis. Commissioner Arnold inquired if Ms. Bergsman is aware of grants that work in conjunction with municipal participation in a public/private partnership. Ms. Bergsman said that foundations very seldom offer this opportunity, but there are alternative foundations that are willing to fund in different ways. Private foundations have a right to choose the kinds of things they will fund. Governmental grants do not have quite as much freedom and there are a lot of governmental grants available. Governmental grants are generally the easiest to write. They not only tell you in general what they will fund, but they will tell you what questions they want you to answer and how they want you to answer them. If you follow federal grants closely, it is a piece of cake because they have done a lot of the work for you. There is also a high administrative cost to federal grant applications because a lot of paperwork has to be filled out and a lot reporting data has to be collected. Ms. Bergsman said that almost any organization with 5010 status is after federal grants. There may be 6,000 grant applications for 280 awards, but it is just as true on the private side. The process for both types is competitive. Corporate partnerships are also very competitive now. The Commission could have an edge if they use a grant writer, but that may be her biased opinion. Even if the Commission chooses to write their own grants, she can review them and help make the grants stronger. She urged them to work closely with the Edmonds -South Snohomish County Historical Society. Commissioner Arnold inquired regarding the average cost of hiring a consultant to write a grant. Ms. Bergsman said that the going rate for a grant writing consultant in Seattle is about $100 per hour. In Snohomish County the rate is under $50 per hour. The length of time required to a write a grant proposal depends upon the grant. A lot of time is spent facilitating meetings, researching, etc. While the grant may only be five pages it may have taken 16 hours to write. If a consultant is used on a regular basis, the more familiar the consultant becomes with the goals and objectives and outcomes, the less time will be needed to become familiar with the organization's goals. b. Commission Reports to the City Council Council Member Plunkett inquired if the Commission is required by code to provide a report to the City Council. Chair Marmion answered that the Commission is required to report to the City Council, but there is no set schedule for when this must happen. Council Member Plunkett suggested that once the CLG status is obtained and the on-line database is available, it might be an appropriate time to provide a report to the City Council. They could announce the CLG status, and then show them the types of data that could be collected. Perhaps they should tentative schedule a date for this report within the next few months. C. Election of Officers Historic Preservation Commission Minutes January 9, 2003 Page 6 COMMISSIONER LEWARNE NOMINATED DARRELL MARMION AS THE COMMISSION CHAIR AND GREG ARNOLD AS THE COMMISSION VICE CHAIR. COMMISSIONER KINDNESS SECONDED THE NOMINATION. THE COMMISSION APPROVED THE NOMINATION UNANIMOUSLY. 8. ADMINISTRATIVE REPORTS Ms. Campbell reported that she has forwarded the Commission Bylaws to the State office to become part of the Commission's Certified Local Government application. 9. REVIEW OF NEXT MEETING PROPOSED AGENDA Chair Marmion advised that at the next meeting he would demonstrate the State's database software. Council Member Plunkett suggested that they also discuss the report to the City Council at the next meeting. He also questioned if the Commission wants to discuss grants further at that time. Commissioner Arnold recalled Ms. Bergsman's comment that before the Commission seeks grant funding, they need to come up with a plan. Perhaps at the next meeting they should discuss the Commission's master plan and how they can bring all of their goals into one plan. Ms. Campbell said that once the Commission starts to place properties on the register, just the work of reviewing changes to the properties and nominations to the register would completely fill their available time. If they have a grand plan over and beyond that, they might end up being disappointed. Chair Marmion suggested that is important to have the plan in place first so that they can work on individual pieces of it. Council Member Plunkett suggested that the ordinance that was approved to establish the Commission identifies a plan. Perhaps they should distill the ordinance and code documents into a two or three -page planning document. Commissioner Waite recalled that Ms. Bergsman was referring more to specific projects or programs that would help them meet their objectives. The Commission agreed that they need to brainstorm the Commission's master plan at the next meeting. Commissioner Arnold suggested that each of the Commissioners review the ordinance prior to that discussion. 10. HISTORIC PRESERVATION CHAIR COMMENTS Chair Marmion provided no additional comments during this portion of the meeting. 11. HISTORIC PRESERVATION MEMBER COMMENTS Commissioner LeWarne said the Snohomish County League of Heritage Organizations is having its annual meeting on January 25 at 12:00 in Snohomish. He noted that one of the speakers would be Jack Williams, who is the chair of the State Advisory Council on Historic Preservation. Commissioner Kindness advised that she would not be present at the February 13 meeting. 12. ADJOURNMENT There being no further business to address, the Commission adjourned at 5:23 p.m. Historic Preservation Commission Minutes January 9, 2003 Page 7