19840731 City Council Minutes436,:
July 31, 1984
•
The quarterly Town Hall meeting of the Edmonds City
Council was called to order at 7:00 p.m. by
.Mayor Larry. Naughte.n in the Plaza Meeting Room of the Edmonds Library. All present joined in the
flag salute.
PRESENT ABSENT
STAFF PRESENT
Larry Naughten, Mayor Lloyd Ostrom
Jim Adams, City Engineer
Jo -Anne Jaech
Mary Lou Block, Planning Director
Steve Dwyer
Jim Jessel, Property Manager
Laura Hall
Pat LeMay, Personnel Director
Bill Kasper
Bobby Mills, Actg. Pub. Wks. Supt.
John Nordquist
Jackie Parrett, City Clerk
Jack Wilson
Dan Prinz, Police Chief
Steve Dahl, Student Rep.
Jeff Ristau, Actg. Finance Director
Steve Simpson, Parks & Rec. Director
Jack Weinz, Fire Chief
Scott Snyder, City Attorney
Shirlie Witzel, Recorder
Councilmember Lloyd Ostrom had..informed.the Council
President that he would not be present for
this meeting since he was out of town on business.
Mayor Naughten welcomed everyone and explained the
format:of the meeting. He invited anyone wishing
to speak to do so as they were recognized by the chair.
Those wishing to submit questions could do
so through moderator Dave Earling, President of the
Edmonds Chamber of Commerce - co-sponsors of the
Town Hall meeting.
Erling Helde, 210 3rd Ave. S., asked.if the buildings at Harbor Square pay a tax to the City or to •
the Port. Acting Finance Director Jeff Ristau replied that the buildings are subject to the same
property tax roll as other properties in.Edmonds. A portion of the property tax goes to the City,
and portions also go to the school district and the.state. Mr. Helde asked if property owners are
required to trim trees and shrubs in sidewalk areas in the same manner they are required to repair
sidewalks. Acting Public Works Superintendent Bobby Mills asked that Mr. Helde give him the address
of any problem areas and he would see'that the problem was corrected.
Don Ginsberg, 19248 93rd Ave..W., described Edmonds as a deteriorating rather than progressive City.
He said the City is overlooking the youth and family base and is not fighting for them. He sees no
programs being planned, but does see the schools, as well as other youth and recreational areas,
leaving the City. He said he would like to see better direction from elected leaders in these
areas. He also mentioned the need for height restrictions on trees. Building height restrictions
have been enforced, but there.is.just as much problem with trees obstructing views, he noted.
Councilmember Wilson described the proposals before the Council relating to proposals for Civic
Center Playfield, Woodway High school fields, the Meadowdale Park area, and recently Olympic Elemen-
tary School. He agreed that the.City has.not adequately addressed the problems of youth activities,
loss of schools, and needs of families moving into the area. He indicated that he would continue to
work for solutions to the problems mentioned. In addition, Councilmember Wilson also felt trees
were the biggest view obstructions.
Mayor Naughten said prior attempts.to restrict tree heights were not pursued because legal opinions
indicated it was not possible. Planning Director Mary Lou Block explained that two meetings had
been held by the Planning Board on the.subject of tree height restrictions and there were strong.
feelings expressed on both sides of the issue. She noted the difficulty in administering and
implementing such a policy. The City does require that commercial and multi -family construction
consider the height of any plantings in a view sensitive area. Councilmember Hall suggested that
formation of a citizen's committee may be a first step to research what is being done in other •
cities concerning this subject.
City Attorney Scott Snyder said another aspect to consider is that of nonconforming use. Any tree
that might be over the height restriction imposed would become a nonconforming use and the trees
that were the tallest and presented the greatest problem could not be touched. In addition, he
said,,a question exists about trees that are now growing. They may be considered nonconforming uses
and the only trees affected would be those planted after the.date of any ordinance. Consequently,
it might be 50 to 100 years before a law to this effect would show any results. Ms. Block said the
City had -looked at the Codes of other cities that have water views and had not found.an,y that deal
with the subject of trees.
Councilmember Wilson suggested formation of a citizen's group, which could contact property owners'
with trees that impinge on other's views. If the problem were explained in a friendly way, it is
possible that solutions could be found. As to the problem -of youth activities, he offered to lend
assistance in whatever area he could and urged citizens to consider the Olympic Elementary property
since it is the last major school property available to the City.
Irene Nagy, 271 4th Ave. S., discussed the issue of the.planning and zoning code for downtown
Edmonds. She emphasized that the people do not want high rises or buildings over 25' in height, nor
high commercial signs. She said. people were tired of fighting the issue every summer but indicated
that they would continue to do so if necessary.
Richard Hill, 1242 Coronado P1., agreed with the previous comments. He said developers want to turn
Edmonds into a combination of all the worst features.of a Northgate shopping mall, Disneyland, and a
freeway interchange. He said the best way to confront this threat is when voting, making sure which
elected officials agree with that type of development and ensure they are not re-elected.
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• July 31, 1984 - continued
Karl Niggol, 809 Walnut St., said the question of tree height may depend on who pays the bill for
cutting the trees. If the cost question could be solved, the tree height problem might be solved,
also. He said a recent article in the Seattle Times stated that putting power lines underground
would be very expensive. In addition, he noted that an engineer from PUD.had said the factory was
closed and the cable was no longer available for putting high voltage power underground. He sug-
gested the PUD should be looking at Europe, where there are no wires and high voltage power lines
are placed underground. Mr. Niggol said the PUD now wants even higher poles with a threat that the
cost will be enormous unless they can do it the cheaper way. Even when they do something cheaply,
the rates charged are always higher.' He suggested the lines be left as they are. He then asked
what the PUD had done for the City of Edmonds and described the underground installation on their
street.
Dave Earling, moderator, read a question from a member of the audience "Would City employees cut
and remove trees if the homeowner agreed?" Mayor Naughten replied that the City.cannot remove a
tree unless it is damaged, is a health hazard, or is in the right-of-way and is causing an obstruc-
tion. Tree removal on private property would be the responsibility of the owner.
Peggy.Harris, 721 Sprague St., asked for an explanation of any plans to raise height restrictions.
After being in business for 24 years, she said no one wants the area to prosper more than she does.
However, she is opposed to high rise buildings and described her past opposition to high rises on
the waterfront.
Mayor Naughton asked Dave Earling to review the history of the D-DAT task force for the information
of those present.
Mr. Earling described the origin and evolution of the D-DAT task force, which was also outlined in a
publication available for distribution at the meeting. He said the task force was looking at over
• 100 recommendations that resulted from the study.conducted in March of this year. He commented on
the recent resignation of Councilmember Lloyd Ostrom from the task force. Mr. Earling listed the
three areas now being considered by the task force: 1. Renegotiation with the Ferry system of the
dock and holding lanes. 2. Recommendation to down zone the business zone to emphasize a triangle
of Main St., Dayton St., and the waterfront. 3. Discussion of marketing recommendations. He said
.the task force is not making any decisions concerning zoning or height restrictions. Mr. Earling
read a letter he had written in response to Councilmember Ostrom's resignation. Mr. Earling listed
the goals set by the task force: 1. Maintain the small town atmosphere, 2. Focus on what the D-
DAT Team was asked to do, .3. Interconnect the downtown triangle mentioned and revitalize the old
downtown area. He.said the task force had spoken of zoning, building heights, parking, store hours,
retail corridors, holding lanes, the ferry pier, highway signing and marketing. The task force will
eventually make recommendations to the Port, the City of Edmonds, the Chamber and the community, he
said; then will be the time for discussion, debate, and decisions.
Councilmember Jaech read a copy of Councilmember Ostrom's letter of resignation into the record.
Mayor Naughten explained that any suggestions or recommendations received from the task force
requiring code changes would have to go to the Planning Board and subsequent public hearings. The
Planning Board recommendations would then be forwarded to the Council and more hearings would be
held. He said the system is designed to avoid rash or quick changes to the Code and the Council
members are aware of public views on and sensitivity to building heights.
Councimember Jaech read a letter from Lois and Tim Lucum, 702'Alder St. Since they were unable to
attend this evening, they wished to express their opinion that there should be controlled growth in
Edmonds along with a healthy business climate. They indicated their desire to retain the unique
character of Edmonds and felt that accomplishing the previous goals was compatible with maintaining
the density, height, and zoning codes now in'effect. A mixture of all ages is necessary to keep the
City vital, they indicated, and asked that children not be zoned out.
• Mr. Ginsberg, previously identified, asked if there were a representative from the Council that
fights Edmonds' battle with the school board? Mayor Naughten said Councilmember Hall acted as the
Council's liaison with the school board. Councilmember Hall emphasized the need for citizen parti-
cipation in school issues such as closures. She had indicated to the School Board the unique
character of Edmonds and the need for a high school as well as the need for a neighborhood school.
She said the enrollment figures are being updated and may be more reliable than the ones that have
been in use for the past -three years. She said the amount of land occupied by each school could
certainly be utilized to a greater extent. Councilmember Hall said the bond issue for $37.6 million
will be on the ballot for "modernization". She indicated doubt as to the exact meaning of the term
and urged each citizen to look into the bond issue and determine how the $37.6 million will be
spent.
Dorothy Williamson, 793.Main St.., said Olympic School, a brick building, had been closed and this
evening a gentleman had stated that it was a good building for the youth of the community. Edmonds
Elementary school was closed and is now being used by approximately 300 people daily and is in good
condition. Madrona Middle school is being closed and has been rented by a Lutheran school. She
said she had worked in two elementary schools that were poorly constructed. She questioned the $37
million. bond issue, since there are many school buildings that are not worth that amount. The
public needs to tell the school board that better buildings are needed for the money being spent.
She said the California type school with large acreage is not needed in this area and asked Council -
member Hall to.let the School Board know how the citizens of Edmonds feel on this issue. She asked
why Olympic School could not be -reopened and close the schools that are falling apart.
Councilmember Hall said she was not the representative to the School Board, the Mayor of Edmonds is
the representative. Those meetings he cannot attend are attended by Councilmember Hall. She
seconded Ms. Williamson's opinion.concerning construction of the buildings that were designed for
warmer climates.. She said Olympic Elementary was going to be condemned when it was closed. Ms.
Williamson noted that Edmonds Elementary was also scheduled to be condemned, but was still in use.
She said the citizens of the community must take a close look at School Board plans.
440.
July 31, 1984 - continued ,
Mayor.-.Naughten-iecessed'the .meeting` for:15 minutes at:8:00 p.m:.
Roger Hertrich, 1020 Puget Dr., spoke concerning the $37 million bond issue. He referred to three
$1 million projects listed in the bond issue: A marine salt water center - what beach does the City
plan to use for this, and two swimming pools for $l million apiece - is the City prepared to share
50% of the cost?. Mayor Naughten responded that the City had not been approached on these items and
suggested the question would be better placed before the School Board.
Mr. Hertrich continued that $2 million was allocated for the High School stadium but nothing for
Edmonds High School itself. He said there were only $163,000 of deficiencies listed for Olympic
Elementary school. However, Mountlake Terrace is shown having $1:5 million deficiencies and a $6
million modernization is planned. He urged voters in Edmonds to ask questions about the bond
issue.
Bill Mathias, 540 Holly Dr., said it may be preliminary to worry about proposals from the D-DAT task
force at this time. However, when conclusions are reached and presented for citizen input, it is
too late. He said the citizens were trying to introduce the idea that there are a substantial
number of people in the community.that want the Community.Development Code to stay as it is.
I. F.. Richardson, 533 Alder St., said he feels one of the main objectives of the D-DAT task force
study is to change the building code and increase building heights. He said this may be only one
item out of 100 but, evidenced.by.the evening's turnout, that item -may be one of the most crucial.
There would be better citizen support if assurances were given at this time that the task force
would concentrate on the 99 other items.
Mr. Earling, as moderator, read "Why do we hear so much conjecture about Yost pool and why haven't
repairs been made?" Parks and Recreation Director Steve Simpson explained that the pool is in.good
condition for being 10 years old. Most of the needed repairs are of a cosmetic nature. In looking •
at needed repairs, the idea of covering the pool was researched. Both a permanent and temporary
cover were examined. The City Council decided not to cover the pool at their last meeting, he said,
and the process has been started to repair the pool this fall.
Councilmember Jaech said the Council had decided not to pay $150,000 for a temporary cover which
would last approximately five years. In discussing devel.opment of the parks, a citizen committee
proposal included a covered pool at the Civic Center Playfield. This was thought to be a good
location since it would be near the youth activities now located.there. She noted that it would
cost almost the same to build..a new pool at the Civic Center as it would be to construct a permanent
cover over the complex at the Yost pool area. She said there will be a public.hearing on the
subject on September 18 and asked for citizen input.
Councilmember Kasper indicated that he had supported a temporary cover for Yost pool and questioned
whether the figures provided at the last Council meeting were accurate. He said a cover would pro-
vide an opportunity to see if the citizens would support a year-round pool before a much larger
amount is spent in constructing a new pool. Other cities have experienced problems in being able to
support a year-round pool after a pool was constructed. In addition, a cover would allow the
remaining life of Yost pool to be.realized to the fullest. He added that a new pool could be funded
through donations, a.trust fund., or a recreation district.
Mr. Earling, moderator, asked for one of the audience, "What the City's long range goals are with
reference to roads, sewers, and sidewalks?" Ms. Block said a comprehensive sidewalk plan will go
before the Planning Board for final review on August 22. It is intended to provide a mechanism to
accomplish sidewalks on roads serving as primary routes for pedestrian activities. She said side-
walks are very important and should be encouraged on residential streets of any length to provide a
place for children to play and adults to walk. She invited interested citizens to contact the
Planning Department for the date of the Council hearing on the sidewalk plan.
City Engineer Jim Adams said all areas within the City limits will be on sewers within the next •
month. As areas are annexed, the requirement for sewers is a condition of annexation. Some areas
are now at capacity and are in the planning stage to be upgraded. He said the City is reaching the
stage where they may have to have secondary treatment.
Mr. Earling, with another question from the audience, asked, "Why do .citizens find it necessary to
fight the high rise question each year? This seems to be an annual question and the developers
should quit raising it."
Mayor Naughten replied that this will probably continue to be an issue because there will always be
someone that wishes to raise the building heights. He said it is a free country, and they have the
right to do that. He said the Council represents the wishes of the majority of the people and would
not be changing those codes.
Milton Tootle, 539 Hemlock Way, complimented the Council. He and his wife have lived in Edmonds for
five years and.find it the most charming community they have ever seen. He said everyone in Edmonds
should be sure to enjoy the view from.9th St. at least once a month, as well as enjoying the flowers
planted in the downtown area and the development of the waterfront. He asked the Council to
maintain Edmonds as it is now.
Natalie Shippen, 1022 Euclid, spoke concerning the D-DAT.recommendation for emphasizing Main St.,
Dayton St., and the waterfront as the core of Edmonds. Suggestions regarding lighting, benches,
extension of flowering areas, landscaping and undergrounding utilities were included in the recom-
mendation, she said. Ms. Shippen suggested that the undergrounding program be reactivated. She
asked the Council to request three undergrounding estimates from the PUD: 1. Dayton St. from 6th
Ave. to Admiral�Way, 2. Along Main St. from 6th to the ferry dock, and 3. Along the waterfront
from the north end of Brackettt's Landing to the south end of Union Oil dock. She also suggested
July 31, 1984 - continued
that the staff prepare landscaping plans for each of the -three legs of the triangle. In regard to
financing, Ms. Shippen said, in prior years the utilities had paid half of the cost in the right-
of-way and the City earmarked $501000 per year of'"the utility tax with a maximum of $150,000. The
PUD agreed to set aside 2% of the Edmonds revenues, up to three years, and allowed the City to draw
on that fund in advance. She said the City could also ask for G.O. bonds or the quarter cent real
estate tax could be earmarked. She said other priorities are being considered but asked that any
tax revenues be spent within the boundaries of Edmonds in areas frequented by residents of all ages.
Councilmember Jaech pointed out that the comment concerning spending money within the city limits
referred to the Meadowdale property which lies within the city limits of Lynnwood.
Maureen Pierre, 21423 92nd Ave W., said it was apparent that every person present shared a common
love for Edmonds and its unique and beautiful qualities as well as a common goal to preserve the
essence of the City while enhancing its economic base. She said the goal will be met because of the
strong feeling evidenced. Ms. Pierre suggested the Council set up a series of meetings paralleling
the D-DAT meetings providing an opportunity for interested citizens to brainstorm the issues as
they are raised.
Ray Martin, 18704 94th Ave. W., in reference to the building heights, asked the newer members of the
Council to express their opinion in regard to a hypothetical situation in which a 40' building
height were proposed. Councilmember Wilson said he would be opposed to that situation. Council -
member Hall said she was opposed to a 40' height. She pointed out that there are some roofs in the
downtown area that are 29' high and are acceptable, so these facts must be carefully examined. She
also stated that she is opposed to condominiums in the downtown area. Councilmember Dwyer said he
would oppose a 40' building height. In addition, he said he would oppose any effort to change or
alter the building heights downtown. He said it would be an inequity to raise the heights, since it
would penalize those people who are complying with the code and would reward those people coming
later who might build higher. Mr. Martin thanked the Council for their responses.
•
Councilmember Dwyer read a note from Jean Yost, 536 Walnut St., which also included pictures of the
building project at 555 Walnut St. depicting the problem .of a,halt in construction and the resultant
impact on a neighborhood. She asked why higher buildings are being constructed since they obstruct
views and impact the neighborhood visually.
Councilmember Jaech said her views on building heights had not changed since her election five years
ago and adamantly opposes any change in building heights. She believes there is.one change that
should be made, to add language concerning a two story limitation. She explained that a development
on sloping land may take the height average of the four corners of the building envelope. This
allows a taller building since land may be excavated and a four story building could be built. The
very thing, she said, the City has tried to avoid.
Mayor Naughten acknowledged the presence of State Representative Katie Allen in the audience and
introduced Student Representative Steve Dahl of Meadowdale High School. The Mayor then thanked the
Edmonds Chamber of Commerce for co -hosting the Town Hall meeting and furnishing the cookies.
The meeting was adjourned at 9:00 p.m.
ty Clerk
CT
LARRY . NAUGRTEN, Mayor